peyton manning is the biggest choke artist in the history of sports
- Thread starter phil
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I have displayed more knowledge than the past arguments. I come with facts and the rest of you all opposing this are just making up scenerios...
First of all, I remember Joey Porter sacking Manning's ass pretty damn good over and over when Indy played against Pittsburgh in the playoffs in 2005! Where was his quick release there? Ahhhh, that's right, his Offensive Line was confused on who to block against an exotic defensive plan... That means no protection and he couldn't do shit!
You are speaking hypothetically and I am speaking reality. What you said above is called anticipation... All QB's do that, not just Manning, LMFAO! To even make it to the NFL you have to anticipate where the WR's, TE, etc. will be! Your telling me Roethlisberger never put it in the perfect spot where only the receiver could catch it? Oh yeah, that's right, Santonio Holmes Super Bowl winning TD against AZ!
Reality is Reality and at the end of the day Roethlisberger is way more clutch under high pressure situations in the big game. Peyton Manning chokes and this last Super Bowl proves it! None of you can run away from that fact! So your arguments are weak, end of story...
First of all, I remember Joey Porter sacking Manning's ass pretty damn good over and over when Indy played against Pittsburgh in the playoffs in 2005! Where was his quick release there? Ahhhh, that's right, his Offensive Line was confused on who to block against an exotic defensive plan... That means no protection and he couldn't do shit!
You are speaking hypothetically and I am speaking reality. What you said above is called anticipation... All QB's do that, not just Manning, LMFAO! To even make it to the NFL you have to anticipate where the WR's, TE, etc. will be! Your telling me Roethlisberger never put it in the perfect spot where only the receiver could catch it? Oh yeah, that's right, Santonio Holmes Super Bowl winning TD against AZ!
Reality is Reality and at the end of the day Roethlisberger is way more clutch under high pressure situations in the big game. Peyton Manning chokes and this last Super Bowl proves it! None of you can run away from that fact! So your arguments are weak, end of story...
What you said in the first paragraph is not reality, GBR! The Colts will never have a great defense as long as they keep spending the big chunks on Offense.
What teams with an Offense like Peyton Manning's have created great defenses without breaking the bank on D? Show me what teams with the evidence? The only teams I can think of are well balanced on both Offense and Defense.
Your last paragraph belongs in some Fantasy Land! I can say the same you said "well Roethlisberger wouldn't be in the same offensive system if he was in Indy" blah blah blah... If Peyton was on The Steelers those years with the same Defense and Offensive players, he would not have been able to make those clutch plays PLEASE BELIEVE! Fact is you are just speaking hypothetical again. Back to reality... Ben is better in the big games!
What teams with an Offense like Peyton Manning's have created great defenses without breaking the bank on D? Show me what teams with the evidence? The only teams I can think of are well balanced on both Offense and Defense.
Your last paragraph belongs in some Fantasy Land! I can say the same you said "well Roethlisberger wouldn't be in the same offensive system if he was in Indy" blah blah blah... If Peyton was on The Steelers those years with the same Defense and Offensive players, he would not have been able to make those clutch plays PLEASE BELIEVE! Fact is you are just speaking hypothetical again. Back to reality... Ben is better in the big games!
You haven't stated anything logical! Your talking about bias in a Bay Area forum??? GBR my thick sweaty nutz! If you want to swing from Fatal's sack than that's on you, because you make yourself look even worse not coming with some facts. At least Fatal tried to make a point, even though he couldn't support it with facts...
There is nothing bias with my comments! If I was bias, I wouldn't put Otto Graham above Roethlisberger and Bradshaw. Graham was a fuckin' Cleveland Brown for god sake's! You think that is easy for me to admit, including when I say Jim Brown was better than any Steelers RB in history?!
You are the one talking out the side of your neck! Don't bother debating this shit if you can't come with a strong argument...
There is nothing bias with my comments! If I was bias, I wouldn't put Otto Graham above Roethlisberger and Bradshaw. Graham was a fuckin' Cleveland Brown for god sake's! You think that is easy for me to admit, including when I say Jim Brown was better than any Steelers RB in history?!
You are the one talking out the side of your neck! Don't bother debating this shit if you can't come with a strong argument...
Being placed in a shitty situation where your special teams and defense dig you a hole throughout the entire game is not choking. When you are losing a game and need more than a touchdown to win you have to make riskier decisions. Throwing the int for a td was not choking. it was an attempt to fix the mistakes of special teams and defense.
Its hard for Manning to look good in a losing effort when special teams, defense, and the running game are all mediocre at best. Manning is one player. It takes a team playing above average to win a superbowl, not one quarterback who is playing amazing.
If anything Stover was the one that choked by missing that 51 yard field goal. He gets paid and practices to do one job and misses a crucial field goal.
He really sucks when it comes to 50+ yard kicks 13-32 in his career
Its hard for Manning to look good in a losing effort when special teams, defense, and the running game are all mediocre at best. Manning is one player. It takes a team playing above average to win a superbowl, not one quarterback who is playing amazing.
If anything Stover was the one that choked by missing that 51 yard field goal. He gets paid and practices to do one job and misses a crucial field goal.
He really sucks when it comes to 50+ yard kicks 13-32 in his career
First of all, missing a 51 yard FG is not choking! You have it all twisted... Also, the running game was there, so watch it over again if you haven't already! The Colts had 99 rushing yards and Addai was picking up big gains on the Audibles (5.9 rush avg.). Manning chose not to run more, by passing instead.
Also, since Manning calls his own plays, why did he choose to play not to lose right before the 1st half??? That's what really lost the Super Bowl for The Colts in my opinion! It fucked up their momentum by playing safe and The Saints came back and collected 3 points right before halftime. Manning called three fuckin' running plays in a row backed up inside his 10 yard line. How chickenshit is that??? I call it premeditated choking! I see teams do it over and over again... It never fails when they "play not to lose" and they end up blowing it!
Manning did choke on that INT!!! If he is so great at reading defenses then why didn't he see the DB jump that route??? Even I can admit when my QB chokes!!! Neil O'Donnell panicked and choked in Super Bowl 20 when the game was on the line! You are just still in denial still my friend...
Also, since Manning calls his own plays, why did he choose to play not to lose right before the 1st half??? That's what really lost the Super Bowl for The Colts in my opinion! It fucked up their momentum by playing safe and The Saints came back and collected 3 points right before halftime. Manning called three fuckin' running plays in a row backed up inside his 10 yard line. How chickenshit is that??? I call it premeditated choking! I see teams do it over and over again... It never fails when they "play not to lose" and they end up blowing it!
Manning did choke on that INT!!! If he is so great at reading defenses then why didn't he see the DB jump that route??? Even I can admit when my QB chokes!!! Neil O'Donnell panicked and choked in Super Bowl 20 when the game was on the line! You are just still in denial still my friend...
You come with facts? You don't even know what this debate is about! You're missing the point completely. LOL!
And how often does that happen to Peyton Manning? Obviously not much, seeing as how he is in the running for MVP every single season and consistently leads his team to 12+ wins. Have you seen how the Colts look when Manning isn't in the game? You can't take one instance and pass it off as if it's what will happen every time. All you have to do is follow the guy and you'll see him exposing defenses every week. Once in a while a defense will have his number, but nobody ever expects it to happen consistently because it never has. My own team had his number when we played in Indianapolis for 95% of the game because of the coverage packages they were using and the pressure they applied. Would I expect it to happen again if the Niners played the Colts again this year? Fuck no. The guy is too damn smart to get knocked off his game like that consistently.
The only reality you've spoken of is the fact that Big Ben has been more clutch, but even in that reality you refuse to acknowledge the FACT that Ben's defense has always been there to help him win these games. Other than that, you're going nowhere.
Obviously most QBs can't handle it, because if they could they'd all have Peyton Manning-like numbers. If everyone did it and did it well, defenses would have to apply new schemes outside of just applying pressure on the QB because they'd all be getting the ball out of their hands much quicker!
Obviously Roethlisburger has done it before. So has Alex Smith. Neither of them do it CONSISTENTLY.
By the way, on that TD drive, Holmes was already headed to the sideline where he caught the ball. That's not even what I'm talking about. Ben knew where he was going to be because he was already headed there. Peyton Manning often throws the ball BEFORE THE RECEIVER EVEN BREAKS OR CUTS and I'm not just talking about fades or post routes. That's why guys like Pierre Garcon and Austin Collie were able to do good things even though neither of them is better than an average receiver.
Even if you had brought up a valid instance of Roethlisburger knowing where the target will be, it doesn't mean much because every decent QB in the history of the league has done it at least a few times. Peyton does it OFTEN.
Congratulations, you've said Roethlisburger is more clutch for the 90th time. That's great. As it turns out though, that's not even what the fuck we're talking about in here. It's not what you and I are talking about, anyway. So you're still way off base. Why was Big Ben even brought up in this conversation to begin with? Nobody outside of Steeler fans will make any sort of argument for Ben against Peyton.
My whole point is Ben always gets help from his defense. Period. He didn't win that Super Bowl with that TD pass to Holmes, the INT return for a TD at the end of the first half when the Cardinals were about to score is what won it. Where was Peyton's defense? Oh yeah, they were letting Drew Brees do whatever the fuck he wanted, meanwhile the special teams was busy not recovering an onside kick. These are FACTS that are easy to overlook when they don't support your argument.
And how often does that happen to Peyton Manning? Obviously not much, seeing as how he is in the running for MVP every single season and consistently leads his team to 12+ wins. Have you seen how the Colts look when Manning isn't in the game? You can't take one instance and pass it off as if it's what will happen every time. All you have to do is follow the guy and you'll see him exposing defenses every week. Once in a while a defense will have his number, but nobody ever expects it to happen consistently because it never has. My own team had his number when we played in Indianapolis for 95% of the game because of the coverage packages they were using and the pressure they applied. Would I expect it to happen again if the Niners played the Colts again this year? Fuck no. The guy is too damn smart to get knocked off his game like that consistently.
The only reality you've spoken of is the fact that Big Ben has been more clutch, but even in that reality you refuse to acknowledge the FACT that Ben's defense has always been there to help him win these games. Other than that, you're going nowhere.
Obviously most QBs can't handle it, because if they could they'd all have Peyton Manning-like numbers. If everyone did it and did it well, defenses would have to apply new schemes outside of just applying pressure on the QB because they'd all be getting the ball out of their hands much quicker!
Obviously Roethlisburger has done it before. So has Alex Smith. Neither of them do it CONSISTENTLY.
By the way, on that TD drive, Holmes was already headed to the sideline where he caught the ball. That's not even what I'm talking about. Ben knew where he was going to be because he was already headed there. Peyton Manning often throws the ball BEFORE THE RECEIVER EVEN BREAKS OR CUTS and I'm not just talking about fades or post routes. That's why guys like Pierre Garcon and Austin Collie were able to do good things even though neither of them is better than an average receiver.
Even if you had brought up a valid instance of Roethlisburger knowing where the target will be, it doesn't mean much because every decent QB in the history of the league has done it at least a few times. Peyton does it OFTEN.
Congratulations, you've said Roethlisburger is more clutch for the 90th time. That's great. As it turns out though, that's not even what the fuck we're talking about in here. It's not what you and I are talking about, anyway. So you're still way off base. Why was Big Ben even brought up in this conversation to begin with? Nobody outside of Steeler fans will make any sort of argument for Ben against Peyton.
My whole point is Ben always gets help from his defense. Period. He didn't win that Super Bowl with that TD pass to Holmes, the INT return for a TD at the end of the first half when the Cardinals were about to score is what won it. Where was Peyton's defense? Oh yeah, they were letting Drew Brees do whatever the fuck he wanted, meanwhile the special teams was busy not recovering an onside kick. These are FACTS that are easy to overlook when they don't support your argument.
^^^ Your missing the whole point completely! Read the thread title!!! Peyton Manning chokes!!! Roethlisberger came in the conversation, because he doesn't choke! End of story!!! Sorry you wasted your time typing all that above, because it wasn't worth reading after couple sentences. Your just repeating the same nonsense and are in denial that Peyton Manning is a choke artist...
Oh yeah, since you sound like another stat nerd, look at the biggest stats that matter between the two in their first handful of years compared. I posted it earlier in the thread... Case closed!
Oh yeah, since you sound like another stat nerd, look at the biggest stats that matter between the two in their first handful of years compared. I posted it earlier in the thread... Case closed!
Regardless of the thread title, the only reason you and I are even exchanging posts is because of the comment you made about how you "SMH" at those of us who know that with a defense like Ben's or Brady's, Peyton would have more rings.
Oh and the stat you speak of is on account of Ben's DEFENSE, and also his second "defense" whom we often refer to as referees. So yes, the case is indeed CLOSED.
Oh and the stat you speak of is on account of Ben's DEFENSE, and also his second "defense" whom we often refer to as referees. So yes, the case is indeed CLOSED.
