Using race as an excuse...

[Lordbyron]

Women usually say I'm long lasting and attractive.



Yes, smarter than you, or did you not comprehend what I previously said?



No actually I am. Anytime I get a person to back peddle and second guess themselves they have already taken the plunge.



See above.



You've used that word twice now. Please step your vocab game up and use different verbs and adjectives.



Unfounded claims. Here it is cmoke introduced rappers and asked, "Shouldnt these people ge dropped from their labels and canned", yet YOU don't see the importance of asking who the label owners are and who benefits from the type of music in question? In your infinite wisdom you fail to see that dropping them is a no no.



This is a fine moment for ignorance.



How did the firing of Imus contribute to Al Sharptons rent? I posted a link to a video clip where Imus made comments about so-called jews in an unsavory fashion. Maybe THAT contributed to his ordeal and the latest episode was the straw that broke the camels back. Given the history of what happens to those in america who say things about "jews" THAT would appear more logical than Sharpton paying his rent. :dead:



No, it is all relevant because it is all derived from CMOKES initial statement. Listen, YOU do NOT understand critical reading, critical thinking, DEDUCTIVE or INDUCTIVE reasoning. Because you don't understand these simple concepts, you constantly run into a brick wall when you ponder why the questions were asked.



Imus has had a HISTORY of using slurs and epithets on his show, so you're going to tell me he was fired just because he said nappy headed hoes? LMAO! Only a FOOL would believe that. Imus was fired because at that point he was a LIABILITY and sponsers were starting to yank ADVERTISEMENT. He made the company LOOSE money you dummy. Those stations didn't fire him because of Al Sharpton or because they wanted to be humanitarians. He was fired because the SPONSERS didn't like the bad attention and didn't want to be associated with him OR his remarks.




Where is the double standard? And no, Simmons was on the opposite side of the field when it happened, and that right there shows you that HE doesn't have a double standard because he CHANGED his perspective and said it SHOULD be banned. :dead:



See above son.



Awe, pooooooooor baby. His da da got the boot now he has to stay in the house with him (alone by the way.) You went from limp to flaccid, can't you use any other terms? How am I hiding behind the same tired civil rights rhetoric when on the first page of this thread I said, "Do I believe Imus should have been fired? Hell no. Do I believe he should have said what he said? Well, why would you say that shit knowing Kramer just took a beating for saying what he said?"

Once again, you're a dummy.



Again, where do you fools come up with the idea that rappers are free from scrutiny? If rappers were free from scrutiny we wouldn't have this convo. If they were free from it Al Sharpton, THE SAME AL SHARPTON YOU CLAIM GOT IMUS FIRED, would NOT have called for 50 Cent records to be be PULLED from shelves. YOU are the one with the double standrad here my puppet.

Also, if rappers are free from scrutiny, what the fuck was C. Delores Tucker doing? So to drive another nail in your coffin, rappers are not free from scrutiny, rappers are free from ACCOUNTABILITY. These are two distinct concepts, and you'll most likely never comprehend the difference.

Scrutiny: a searching examination or investigation; minute inquiry.

Accountability: the state of being accountable, liable, or answerable.



Again, do you see the label owners stopping it?



No, there is no accountability, and as soon as accountability is enforced, the companies will loose revenue. Do you not see how the business aspect works?



Stupidity at its finest.



Go back ad read everything again.

Ahh... An argument that can stand on its own... No need for limps or flaccids this round... Cmoke asked if there was a RACIAL double standard at work here... I'm arguing that, yes, indeed there is... And why I do say that music industry politics are irrelevant...? Because Black folks, and 'joos' have both lined their pockets from the growth of rap music... Bob Johnson became a media mogul off of rap videos... And before Clear Channel swallowed radio, Black stations were making a killing spinning Snoop, Scarface, and Dre records... J-Prince, Russell Simmons, and Percy Miller all signed off on checks for some of the grimiest rappers the genre has produced... African American mom and pops from LA to NY stock their shelves with 50 Cent albums, Young Jeezy mixtapes, and G-Unit shirts... Why...? To get their piece of this hip hop gravy train... If White men were the only ones benefiting (financially) from all this then it would be a valid point... Cmoke asks if these rappers should be dropped... I'm not aruging ye or ne... But that they aren't because the community at large (not the elites... Rev. Butts, or Delores Tucker) doesn't have the same knee jerk reactions to gratuitous language coming from the mouths of Black rappers, that it does when those same words come out of the mouths of White men... Some Black women sing Too Short lyrics verbatim (Biiiiiiiitch included) but those same Black women are not gonna allow their sisters at Rutgers to be disrespected by my da da Don Imus... (No he din't)... And there you have it the RACIAL double standard... Now what does Al Sharptons rent have to do with my daddy getting the boot...? I'll tell you... Mr. Doo was the loudest voice calling for the termination of my papa... And what is Mr. Sharptons' (and the Black community in general) weapon of choice...? The BOYCOTT... The sponsors were on edge because of Rev. Al's W.M.D.... Nothing more nothing less... The Jews...? I might be off on this one but they don't seem as sensetive to epithets as Black folks... Jesse Jacksons' 'Jamie Town' remark doesn't seem to have slowed his career any... Mr. Allah U Akbar, Louis Farrakhan is always going off on some anti-semitic rant, but he still managed to organize a gathering of one million men...:ermmAn impressive trade highlight)... Though the jury is still out on Mel Gibson... We'll have to see how the rest of his career pans out... But so far his talk show rounds seem to have done the trick... Now once again my critical thinking skills, my ability to critically read, and my capability to reason are all fine dodo bird... I hadn't read a single post of yours until you responded to one of mine... And even then I didn't go back and read your drivel on page one... As you say 'ignorance is no excuse'... Well in this case, it is... And you my friend are grasping at straws...:dead: I will however give you a point for your scrutiny argument... Consider it a technical foul free throw...

 

[WHITE DEVIL]

In retrospect I think JD may have been banned for his butchery of the english language.

 

[ParkBoyz]

Ahh... An argument that can stand on its own... No need for limps or flaccids this round... Cmoke asked if there was a RACIAL double standard at work here... I'm arguing that, yes, indeed there is... And why I do say that music industry politics are irrelevant...? Because Black folks, and 'joos' have both lined their pockets from the growth of rap music... Bob Johnson became a media mogul off of rap videos... And before Clear Channel swallowed radio, Black stations were making a killing spinning Snoop, Scarface, and Dre records... J-Prince, Russell Simmons, and Percy Miller all signed off on checks for some of the grimiest rappers the genre has produced... African American mom and pops from LA to NY stock their shelves with 50 Cent albums, Young Jeezy mixtapes, and G-Unit shirts... Why...? To get their piece of this hip hop gravy train... If White men were the only ones benefiting (financially) from all this then it would be a valid point... Cmoke asks if these rappers should be dropped... I'm not aruging ye or ne... But that they aren't because the community at large (not the elites... Rev. Butts, or Delores Tucker) doesn't have the same knee jerk reactions to gratuitous language coming from the mouths of Black rappers, that it does when those same words come out of the mouths of White men... Some Black women sing Too Short lyrics verbatim (Biiiiiiiitch included) but those same Black women are not gonna allow their sisters at Rutgers to be disrespected by my da da Don Imus... (No he din't)... And there you have it the RACIAL double standard... Now what does Al Sharptons rent have to do with my daddy getting the boot...? I'll tell you... Mr. Doo was the loudest voice calling for the termination of my papa... And what is Mr. Sharptons' (and the Black community in general) weapon of choice...? The BOYCOTT... The sponsors were on edge because of Rev. Al's W.M.D.... Nothing more nothing less... The Jews...? I might be off on this one but they don't seem as sensetive to epithets as Black folks... Jesse Jacksons' 'Jamie Town' remark doesn't seem to have slowed his career any... Mr. Allah U Akbar, Louis Farrakhan is always going off on some anti-semitic rant, but he still managed to organize a gathering of one million men...:ermmAn impressive trade highlight)... Though the jury is still out on Mel Gibson... We'll have to see how the rest of his career pans out... But so far his talk show rounds seem to have done the trick... Now once again my critical thinking skills, my ability to critically read, and my capability to reason are all fine dodo bird... I hadn't read a single post of yours until you responded to one of mine... And even then I didn't go back and read your drivel on page one... As you say 'ignorance is no excuse'... Well in this case, it is... And you my friend are grasping at straws...:dead: I will however give you a point for your scrutiny argument... Consider it a technical foul free throw...

1. White people are the major consumers for rap music.

2. Artists signed to Major cooperate labels ran by whites and joos have no creative control whatsoever, as marketers go by trends.

3. Moms and pops stores make less than Jew, Arab, and Oriental stores that suck the life out of the black community.

4. All rappers don't say "bitch" "ho" and "nigga", and none of these words carry an ill racial intent in that context(not to justify it, but it isn't an excuse for Imus either).

5. There is not one double standard in America that is of the Black man's making so what do these double standards have to do with "Black people".


6. You have no point..

 

[Cmoke]

^^^^haha you have to be joking.

1. please cite where you found this information, at least 3 websites.

2. bullshit. standards are still supposed to be upheld.

3. really? not relevant.

4. The majority do, if i were to guestimate i would conclude about 97 % of them do. None of the terms nigga, nigger, ho, bitch, trick, carry anye ill racial content? you serious? So its cool then for a white dude to be rappin and spittin the word nigga? cool. what context? cuz its a song now its cool? ha. and if thats true, whys your homeboy IMUS gettn bashed on by every black power representitive out there calling for his roasting publicly?

5. Ignorance is bliss. You are one entertaining individual. Not one double standard of a black mans making huh? HA. Seriously you cant even say something like that without being laughed at. please tell me you're not serious.

6. Again if theres no point then why are you on the defense 3 times every page of the thread? Theres a point. If white folks cant say nappy headed hoes, nigga etc, and get away with no reprecussions, then the same applies to colored people who call people crackers and honkies. They are using race as an excuse for a pass and as a reason to attack anyone who says anything borderline racist.

 

[ParkBoyz]

^^^^haha you have to be joking.

1. please cite where you found this information, at least 3 websites.

You're only worth one since I don't feel like wasting my time convincing you that the sky is blue..

Quote:

"The commercial packaging and marketing of Hip Hop culture as a global commodity has facilitated its easy access by young people worldwide (Bennett 1999) - the consequence being the upward mobility of Black youth who now profits from its popularity. Rap music continues to outsell all other genres of popular music in America and many other places around the world. Since Americans of African decent comprise of about 12% percent of America's population, this means that the vast majority of documented rap music consumers are White teenagers." - Dr Karen Malone (Faculty of Education Monash University, Peninsula Campus VIC 3199)

http://www.aare.edu.au/02pap/mal02539.htm

2. bullshit. standards are still supposed to be upheld.

^By who? Poor black men barely rising out of grotesque poverty, broken homes, and lack of opportunity, or established white male role models armed with a platform and millions of dollars? Please..

3. really? not relevant.

Yes really, mr. I wanna be skeptical of every well documented claim for convenience of saving face..

4. The majority do, if i were to guestimate i would conclude about 97 % of them do. None of the terms nigga, nigger, ho, bitch, trick, carry anye ill racial content? you serious? So its cool then for a white dude to be rappin and spittin the word nigga? cool. what context? cuz its a song now its cool? ha. and if thats true, whys your homeboy IMUS gettn bashed on by every black power representitive out there calling for his roasting publicly?.

^No the majority do not, it depends on what genre, maybe most gangster rappers do since it's their job among such pressures to uphold that image and standard at the label since the consumer expects certain things. Another Straw Man argument, I said they don't carry any ill racial intent in that context as it isn't directed with any negative energy and is over generalized as a fad that sees to appease the consumer. Imus got blasted because CBS chose to blast him, why can't you get that through your hollow skull?..

5. Ignorance is bliss. You are one entertaining individual. Not one double standard of a black mans making huh? HA. Seriously you cant even say something like that without being laughed at. please tell me you're not serious.

You're the most blissful person in this thread.. Prove me wrong or just laugh yourself to sleep then because I remain uncorrected..

6. Again if theres no point then why are you on the defense 3 times every page of the thread? Theres a point. If white folks cant say nappy headed hoes, nigga etc, and get away with no reprecussions, then the same applies to colored people who call people crackers and honkies. They are using race as an excuse for a pass and as a reason to attack anyone who says anything borderline racist.

There is no point and I'm replying because it's intriguing that some how you can still go on and on about nothing whatsoever.. Who are "they"? Are you seriously generalizing the entire black community, deciding now to unleash your contained rage and contempt towards black people on a hip hop forum? You are one screwed in the head racialist fag..

 

[HERESY]

Ahh... An argument that can stand on its own... No need for limps or flaccids this round...

Is that what your mother tells you when your father leaves?

Cmoke asked if there was a RACIAL double standard at work here... I'm arguing that, yes, indeed there is...

Again, where is the double standard? If black people are calling for rappers to tone it down, where is the double standard? Does it lie within all of the black community or a certain group? Also, what about the white double standard? If the lyrics are toned down, and people no longer buy the albums, who is going to loose the most money from adverts and sponsers?

And why I do say that music industry politics are irrelevant...? Because Black folks, and 'joos' have both lined their pockets from the growth of rap music...

Minorities comprise 85-90% of people employed in the music industry (artists etc) yet they don't even own 10% of the wealth, so who's really lining their pockets? :dead:

Bob Johnson became a media mogul off of rap videos... And before Clear Channel swallowed radio, Black stations were making a killing spinning Snoop, Scarface, and Dre records... J-Prince, Russell Simmons, and Percy Miller all signed off on checks for some of the grimiest rappers the genre has produced...

What "black stations" were making a killing spinning those records? And while the three men you listed may have signed off on checks, you fail to realize that whites and "joos" signed off checks to them. NONE of the guys you listed controlled their company 100%. They were subsideries or had distribution deals with larger companies (these are called 1 deep, 2 deep, and 3 deep deals depending on how far away the subsidery is from the main company.)

African American mom and pops from LA to NY stock their shelves with 50 Cent albums,Young Jeezy mixtapes, and G-Unit shirts...Why...? To get their piece of this hip hop gravy train...

Actually many of them don't, and they can't push enough of those units to warrant the purchase of the next batch, and when you have WAL MART (the largest retailer of music), Best Buys, Tower, and ONLINE SERVICES such as iTunes, it becomes hard for mom & pop stores to stay afloat because they don't have the resources and technology.

If White men were the only ones benefiting (financially) from all this then it would be a valid point...

Not true. It is a valid argument because white men are the ones who EMPLOY these rappers (major ones), just like they are the ones who employ IMUS, so why do WHITES have a double standard? :dead:

Cmoke asks if these rappers should be dropped... I'm not aruging ye or ne... But that they aren't because the community at large (not the elites... Rev. Butts, or Delores Tucker) doesn't have the same knee jerk reactions to gratuitous language coming from the mouths of Black rappers, that it does when those same words come out of the mouths of White men...

So basically you admit to NOT answering cmokes question and arguing a mute point. Good job, johnny. And how do you know the community doesn't have the same reaction? When was the last time you collected empirical data and constructed a poll on the subject?

Some Black women sing Too Short lyrics verbatim (Biiiiiiiitch included) but those same Black women are not gonna allow their sisters at Rutgers to be disrespected by my da da Don Imus... (No he din't)...

This is a genralization with no evidence to support it.

And there you have it the RACIAL double standard...

No, you and your buddy have yet to explain this double standard.

Now what does Al Sharptons rent have to do with my daddy getting the boot...? I'll tell you... Mr. Doo was the loudest voice calling for the termination of my papa... And what is Mr. Sharptons' (and the Black community in general) weapon of choice...? The BOYCOTT...

Pappa Perm was the loudest PUBLIC critique, but you fail to realize there were things going on in the background. And yes, the Boycott is the weapon of choice for some, and if that is the weapon that wakes white america up, use it every chance you can.

The sponsors were on edge because of Rev. Al's W.M.D.... Nothing more nothing less...

So this all boils back down to money, which is why some of the sponsers were considering pulling out BEFORE Al even stepped in, :dead: x your argument. Again, Al Sharpton, the SAME guy who called for your daddy to get the boot is the SAME guy who called for 50 cent records to get yanked from shelves. Why do you fail to acknowledge these facts?

The Jews...? I might be off on this one but they don't seem as sensetive to epithets as Black folks... Jesse Jacksons' 'Jamie Town' remark doesn't seem to have slowed his career any...

No, so-called jews are sensetive to epithets, and they are even MORE sensetive when it comes to the holocaust and holocaust denial. There are no laws denying slavery, saying blacks sold slaves, saying less people died than reported, but did you know there are LAWS against denying the holocaust? So if you REALLY want to talk about a humans freedom of speech, the so -called jews, and how sensitive they are, make sure you hit this link before you do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_denial#Laws_against_Holocaust_denial

BTW, Jackson did catch some heat for his statement.

Mr. Allah U Akbar, Louis Farrakhan is always going off on some anti-semitic rant, but he still managed to organize a gathering of one million men...

I don't believe he has said anything anti-semetic. How can he possibly say something anti-semetic about so-called jews when they aren't semetic?

Though the jury is still out on Mel Gibson... We'll have to see how the rest of his career pans out...

As long as mel stays off the bottle, and has a couple of good WHITE friends he'll be ok.

Now once again my critical thinking skills, my ability to critically read, and my capability to reason are all fine dodo bird..

No they aren't bucko. You repeat the same thing over and over like a 4 bar loop in pro tools, and you can't address the majority of the questions and posts derived from your statements.

You went on a tangent talking about scrutiney, but when the definitions were shown, and I placed emphasis on accountability you failed to answer. On another page you said, "If rappers are using those words gratuitously and no one cares, why can't the rest of us...?", but you fail to realize that people DO care, and no I'm not just talking about people like Sharpton, The Naacp, Jackson or Tucker (when she was alive.) Did you know Nelly was BANNED from certain colleges and caught a lot of heat from several frats because of his lyrics and music videos? So again, where do you fools get the idea that no one cares?

You don't see the importance of asking who the label owners are and who benefits from the type of music in question, which is why you sidestepped cmokes question about being dropped from the label.

You have failed to address the label owners hand in this and have yet to give your take on their responsibility.

You also fail to address that IMUS was talking about someone SPECIFIC where as rappers are NOT, and this is a very valid point because he was making PERSONAL ATTACKS.

So no, your skills are shot to hell buddy, and those are just examples I found on the previous page and this one.

I hadn't read a single post of yours until you responded to one of mine... And even then I didn't go back and read your drivel on page one... As you say 'ignorance is no excuse'... Well in this case, it is... And you my friend are grasping at straws...

Finally, a new word, although I've used that word too many times here. Step your game up bud. You know you went back and read everything I typed.

I will however give you a point for your scrutiny argument... Consider it a technical foul free throw...

First of all, you don't give me shit, and the fact you're once again back-peddling proves what I've been saying all along. LOL!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MR.VILLAIN]

He was fired because advertisers were pulling their ads.

It had less to do with the commentary, more to do with the paper.

 

[Lordbyron]

Is that what your mother tells you when your father leaves?



Again, where is the double standard? If black people are calling for rappers to tone it down, where is the double standard? Does it lie within all of the black community or a certain group? Also, what about the white double standard? If the lyrics are toned down, and people no longer buy the albums, who is going to loose the most money from adverts and sponsers?



Minorities comprise 85-90% of people employed in the music industry (artists etc) yet they don't even own 10% of the wealth, so who's really lining their pockets? :dead:



What "black stations" were making a killing spinning those records? And while the three men you listed may have signed off on checks, you fail to realize that whites and "joos" signed off checks to them. NONE of the guys you listed controlled their company 100%. They were subsideries or had distribution deals with larger companies (these are called 1 deep, 2 deep, and 3 deep deals depending on how far away the subsidery is from the main company.)



Actually many of them don't, and they can't push enough of those units to warrant the purchase of the next batch, and when you have WAL MART (the largest retailer of music), Best Buys, Tower, and ONLINE SERVICES such as iTunes, it becomes hard for mom & pop stores to stay afloat because they don't have the resources and technology.



Not true. It is a valid argument because white men are the ones who EMPLOY these rappers (major ones), just like they are the ones who employ IMUS, so why do WHITES have a double standard? :dead:



So basically you admit to NOT answering cmokes question and arguing a mute point. Good job, johnny. And how do you know the community doesn't have the same reaction? When was the last time you collected empirical data and constructed a poll on the subject?



This is a genralization with no evidence to support it.



No, you and your buddy have yet to explain this double standard.



Pappa Perm was the loudest PUBLIC critique, but you fail to realize there were things going on in the background. And yes, the Boycott is the weapon of choice for some, and if that is the weapon that wakes white america up, use it every chance you can.



So this all boils back down to money, which is why some of the sponsers were considering pulling out BEFORE Al even stepped in, :dead: x your argument. Again, Al Sharpton, the SAME guy who called for your daddy to get the boot is the SAME guy who called for 50 cent records to get yanked from shelves. Why do you fail to acknowledge these facts?



No, so-called jews are sensetive to epithets, and they are even MORE sensetive when it comes to the holocaust and holocaust denial. There are no laws denying slavery, saying blacks sold slaves, saying less people died than reported, but did you know there are LAWS against denying the holocaust? So if you REALLY want to talk about a humans freedom of speech, the so -called jews, and how sensitive they are, make sure you hit this link before you do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_denial#Laws_against_Holocaust_denial

BTW, Jackson did catch some heat for his statement.



I don't believe he has said anything anti-semetic. How can he possibly say something anti-semetic about so-called jews when they aren't semetic?



As long as mel stays off the bottle, and has a couple of good WHITE friends he'll be ok.



No they aren't bucko. You repeat the same thing over and over like a 4 bar loop in pro tools, and you can't address the majority of the questions and posts derived from your statements.

You went on a tangent talking about scrutiney, but when the definitions were shown, and I placed emphasis on accountability you failed to answer. On another page you said, "If rappers are using those words gratuitously and no one cares, why can't the rest of us...?", but you fail to realize that people DO care, and no I'm not just talking about people like Sharpton, The Naacp, Jackson or Tucker (when she was alive.) Did you know Nelly was BANNED from certain colleges and caught a lot of heat from several frats because of his lyrics and music videos? So again, where do you fools get the idea that no one cares?

You don't see the importance of asking who the label owners are and who benefits from the type of music in question, which is why you sidestepped cmokes question about being dropped from the label.

You have failed to address the label owners hand in this and have yet to give your take on their responsibility.

You also fail to address that IMUS was talking about someone SPECIFIC where as rappers are NOT, and this is a very valid point because he was making PERSONAL ATTACKS.

So no, your skills are shot to hell buddy, and those are just examples I found on the previous page and this one.



Finally, a new word, although I've used that word too many times here. Step your game up bud. You know you went back and read everything I typed.



First of all, you don't give me shit, and the fact you're once again back-peddling proves what I've been saying all along. LOL!!!!!!!!!!

The double standard lies in the community itself... While some of the elites are asking rappers to tone it down a large part of the AA community isn't... Not only that but a large portion of the community use those words themselves... Asking rappers to tone it down without asking the community to first censor itself is backwards... Seeing as how most of these rappers are products of those communities... Moving along... Since 85% of the wealth in the U.S. is in the hands of the top 20%... I'd argue that the music industry is simply a microcosm of wealth distribution in this country... And 100% ownership of any company is seldom in the hands of a single entity... Boards, Chairman, CEO's... All line their pockets... Even minority (stock holders) owners get paid... Just basic business models... Now, what White double standard do you mean...? I've never heard that argument before but I'm interested in where you're going with it... As for arguing a mute point, it's not mute just one some AA have a hard time acknowledging... Offical poles...? I consider my time spent in juke-joints as evidence enough... (You ain't nothing but a hoochie mama/ Hood-rat hood-rat/ Hoochie mama)... Black folks never pulled the plug on the DJ when that song came on... Now back to Mr. Doo, I wasn't aware that he called for a boycott of 50's record... But, If he did then he's showing a bit of consistency... Jews... I don't have time now to read the link but I'll peep it later... Like I said, I might be off on that one... And yes, Jesse Jackson did catch a little heat from his slip of the tounge but not enough to slow him down... Which has always surprised me...:ermm: Now I can't front, when I read your Farrakhan rebuttal I laughed... Good one... Really good... Ummm... Lets see... My faculties...! It's not that I can't reply to the majority of questions and posts derived from my statements it's that I don't... I honestly don't have the time to... I've got what 400 plus posts in just under two years... It's simply an issue of time... Or lack there of... You engaged me first so I've responded primarily to your questions and posts... Now The scrutiny argument... I simply got sloppy dropped my guard and you caught me on the chin... I should've said peer scrutiny or something to that effect... But I didn't... No need to argue (or answer) I simply conceded the point to you... 'No one cares' I realize people do care... Again I just got sloppy... I should've worded that one differently... But again I didn't... So on to the St. Lunatic... I know Spellman turned Nelly away but I was under the impression that his depiction of women (In tip Drill) as opposed to his description of women (On record) is what lead to that... But frats...? I have yet to hear about any frat banning Nelly... I find that hard to believe... Now In terms of not addressing label ownership and their responsibility, side stepping Cmokes question, and the like, is simply a matter of arguing that the community (outside of the elites) should take responsibility for what it is and isn't willing to accept from artists that the community itself produces... Same stuff I said at the top... And back to my daddy... Are you arguing that If Imus had made a general referance to Black women as 'Nappy headed hoes' he'd still have a job...?:ermm:

 

[REdRUM]

To say that rappers don't talk about anyone specifically is ridiculous. Refer to Game's ''Wouldn't Get Far'', where he mentions by name Hoopz, Vida Guerra, Melissa Ford, etc.

Now, I don't feel Imus should have been fired, and I agree with the ''different media outlets'' notion, but what people are unable to admit is he was fired because he was WHITE, and offended BLACKS. Period. That's why Al Sharpton (Rev. my ass) was all over the place (free publicity), and he was roasted before being canned.

When D.L. Hugley got on national TV and agreed with Imus, said the same things Imus did, it was FUNNY.

At least, it was funny to him.

It WAS a double standard, but really...does it matter? There's nothing that can or will be done about it. No one (that matters) is calling for Game's firing; poor Imus (LOL) was just born the wrong color when it comes to nappy headed hoes comments.

The people ''in charge'', in a position of power who had the most to gain weren't gaining anything with this, it was going to hurt them in the short and long term. Rappers MAKE MONEY for saying bitches, hoes, whores, sluts, cock sucking cum guzzling anal wart infected cock holes, etc...because that is what America (mainly) wants from them. They will actually PAY to hear these rappers say that. If Game, or Jeezy, or whoever else were to come out with a record and call a hoodrat a 'confused and misguided individual with a sad habit of sleeping around', they'd get tossed out of the deck.


Sidenote: I wonder if Sharpton took personal offense to the nappy headed hoes comment...hit a little close to home, Al?

 

[Cmoke]

sadly it will continue to happen probably for as long as i live.

 

[HERESY]

The double standard lies in the community itself... While some of the elites are asking rappers to tone it down a large part of the AA community isn't...

And a large part of the community goes to church every sunday with the purpose of paying a preacher and condemning rap music. The "elites" are not the only ones asking them to tone down their lyrics. You have teachers, students, mentors and child advocacy groups all saying the same thing --clean up the lyrics.

Not only that but a large portion of the community use those words themselves...

You keep saying "a large portion" but where is this large portion? What is this claim based on? The same way you say a large portion of the community uses those words, I can say a large portion doesn't. I can site the black muslims, many black christians, black religious/spiritual people, BSU members, those in law enforcement, etc.

Asking rappers to tone it down without asking the community to first censor itself is backwards...

If the entire community is not using those words it doesn't make sense to ask the community to censor itself. A more appropriate action would be to have the members using the words to censor themselves. Also, if it is a step backwards, you no longer can use the "Rappers need to tone it down argument" because once you've now shifted the blame from the rapper to the community. And once you loose that argument, you loose the majority of your "double standard" position which was originally directed at RAPPERS and not the community. :dead:

Seeing as how most of these rappers are products of those communities...

No, some of them are products of their environment. Others are simply riding the wave.

Moving along... Since 85% of the wealth in the U.S. is in the hands of the top 20%... I'd argue that the music industry is simply a microcosm of wealth distribution in this country...And 100% ownership of any company is seldom in the hands of a single entity... Boards, Chairman, CEO's... All line their pockets... Even minority (stock holders) owners get paid... Just basic business models..

This is useless info, and I believe you typed that just to fill up space and to sound as if you actually understand what I am conveying in this thread. I have not stated that 100% ownership was in the hands of a sole person, OTHER people in this thread have, so if I were you I would make sure that it wasn't me and double check a couple of my posts. BTW, where are these radio stations you spoke of in your last post?

Now, what White double standard do you mean...? I've never heard that argument before but I'm interested in where you're going with it...

There are many white double standards, and I've listed several in this thread. I'll give you one more:

White American Double Standard # 23,786,899:

Wanting the african american community to censor itself and not use the word while NEVER taking responsibility for 400 years of derogatory use and implementation of said word. :dead:

As for arguing a mute point, it's not mute just one some AA have a hard time acknowledging...

Like the one white america is having a hard time acknowledging?

consider my time spent in juke-joints as evidence enough... (You ain't nothing but a hoochie mama/ Hood-rat hood-rat/ Hoochie mama)...

LMAO! This is based on YOUR experience, and trust me, not everyone has the same experience as you. There are plenty of people who have never been to a "juke joint" and prefer to stay the hell away from that type of environment. With that being said, you have another unsubstantiated claim and no way to actually prove your point (again.)

Now back to Mr. Doo, I wasn't aware that he called for a boycott of 50's record... But, If he did then he's showing a bit of consistency...

Lack of knowledge on your part is not an excuse.

But, If he did then he's showing a bit of consistency... Jews... I don't have time now to read the link but I'll peep it later...

Do it. You'll see there are LAWS prohibting a person from DENYING the holocaust. That should be enough proof as to who the most sensetive are.

My faculties...! It's not that I can't reply to the majority of questions and posts derived from my statements it's that I don't... I honestly don't have the time to... I've got what 400 plus posts in just under two years... It's simply an issue of time... Or lack there of..

You know your schedule.

I know Spellman turned Nelly away but I was under the impression that his depiction of women (In tip Drill) as opposed to his description of women (On record) is what lead to that... But frats...? I have yet to hear about any frat banning Nelly... I find that hard to believe...

Typo on my part. There were sorrorities (not frats) who issued a ban on his products and prohibited members from playing the music etc. The sorrorities were the main ones pushing to have him yanked from college shows and were one of teh main reasons why he caught flack for sliding a credit card between some nappy headed hoe's ass cheecks.

Now In terms of not addressing label ownership and their responsibility, side stepping Cmokes question, and the like, is simply a matter of arguing that the community (outside of the elites) should take responsibility for what it is and isn't willing to accept from artists that the community itself produces...

How can you effectively combat when the people promoting the music are bombarding you with images on the tv, sounds on the radio and tangible items? So what you're basically saying is whites and "joo's" have the right to promote the music but blacks don't have the right to make it? What you're saying is blacks should take responsibility for the music the community produces but whites should not take responsibility for marketing and promoting it? Double standard?!?!?!?! :dead:

And back to my daddy... Are you arguing that If Imus had made a general referance to Black women as 'Nappy headed hoes' he'd still have a job...?

Yes. Do you think this is the first time your Pa has something like that? I had a link to some of his past radio shows and on one show he talked about a "colored woman" and how she killed herself because she spoke, her lips vibrated, hit her head and caused her brain to fall out. Imho, that is FAR worse than "nappy headed hoes", but nappy headed hoes was bad because was talking about a specific person and wasn't telling a story.

 

[HERESY]

sadly it will continue to happen probably for as long as i live.

You avoiding the questions? I agree.

 

[HERESY]

To say that rappers don't talk about anyone specifically is ridiculous.

I see you like to comment without reading. Read this:

while rappers usually use those terms in a general sense.

Next time utilize critical reading, thinking and responding skills before you post. What others are talking about is the OVERALL use of said language in the community.

Refer to Game's ''Wouldn't Get Far'', where he mentions by name Hoopz, Vida Guerra, Melissa Ford, etc.

SEE ABOVE. BTW, they are all in the entertainment industry and have a forum to speak out against Game. Imus is a radio jock and reaches millions. How do you expect for college girls to address the issue and defend themselves? Do they have the same type of outlet as Imus? No?

Now, I don't feel Imus should have been fired, and I agree with the ''different media outlets'' notion, but what people are unable to admit is he was fired because he was WHITE, and offended BLACKS.Period.

No, what people are failing to admit is that he was fired because he was a liability to the company and caused sponsers and those paying for adverts to pull out. Period.

That's why Al Sharpton (Rev. my ass) was all over the place (free publicity), and he was roasted before being canned.

Al Sharpton was also spearheading a movement to have 50 and Tony Yayo records yanked from shelves. Did it happen? No. Did white A&R people get fired behind it? No. Now if Al Sharpton has that much pull, and Imus was fired because he was WHITE, why then was no one fired when Al had his ban 50 campaign? How come whites weren't fired over that? How come 50 wasn't released from his contract?

When D.L. Hugley got on national TV and agreed with Imus, said the same things Imus did, it was FUNNY.

Funny to certain people. And there ARE nappy headed hoes, just like there are stringy haired caveman bitches who smell like wet mutts. Deal with it and move on. Oh but you can't! You can't because issues of race and instituinalized deviance are swept under the rug and never given the light of day until the shit hits the fan.

It WAS a double standard, but really...does it matter? There's nothing that can or will be done about it. No one (that matters) is calling for Game's firing; poor Imus (LOL) was just born the wrong color when it comes to nappy headed hoes comments.

If you are implying or believe that Al has power the above is 100% false because Al called for a ban on "violent rap lyrics" and listed the game and 50 at the top of the list.

The people ''in charge'', in a position of power who had the most to gain weren't gaining anything with this, it was going to hurt them in the short and long term.

This is why he was fired.

Rappers MAKE MONEY for saying bitches, hoes, whores, sluts, cock sucking cum guzzling anal wart infected cock holes, etc...because that is what America (mainly) wants from them.

LABELS make MORE MONEY when rappers make money saying bitches, hoes, whores, sluts, cock sucking cum guzzling anal wart infected cock holes, etc...because that is what the majority of WHITE MALES who purchase rap cds want to hear. :dead:

If Game, or Jeezy, or whoever else were to come out with a record and call a hoodrat a 'confused and misguided individual with a sad habit of sleeping around', they'd get tossed out of the deck.

Pac did it. KRS did it. Chuck D did it. Common did it. Mos Def did it. Dead Prez did it.

 

[REdRUM]

And Pac also talked about bitches and hoes. KRS is no longer relevant, and hasn't been. Same with Chuck D. Common couldn't go platinum on a consistant basis EVER. Mos Def and dead prez...same thing.

I agree with what you're saying, and maybe I wasn't relaying my thoughts in the way that I felt. Imus was NOT making the type of money 50 Cent and company were for the company...that is why I feel he was fired, more than anything. I do believe race had something to do with it, but yeah, I guess your reasoning does make more sense.

I think it's a matter of "who's who'', and Imus really wasn't anybody when it was all said and done.

 

[HERESY]

And Pac also talked about bitches and hoes.

He sure did, but my point wasn't that he didn't talk about them. My point was to show you that he talked about what YOU implied would get a cd or artist tossed out.

KRS is no longer relevant, and hasn't been.

Highly relevent.

Same with Chuck D.

Sophisticated Bitch. She Watch Channel Zero. Chuck had many songs about women being blinded etc.

Common couldn't go platinum on a consistant basis EVER.

How does that detract from the fact that he hasn't made songs degrading women?

Mos Def and dead prez...same thing.

see above.

I agree with what you're saying, and maybe I wasn't relaying my thoughts in the way that I felt. Imus was NOT making the type of money 50 Cent and company were for the company...that is why I feel he was fired, more than anything.

The contract Imus had with the company was worth $50 million. Did 50 cent sign for 50 million? In addition, the show generated $15 million per year from syndication fees and adverts. :dead:

I do believe race had something to do with it, but yeah, I guess your reasoning does make more sense.

Race has nothing to do with it. Race is the veil that prohibits people from seeing the real picture. The black dollar goes a long way in this country, and once that dollar is compromised people take notice. This is america, these are corporations we are talking about here. They don't give a shit about answering to the community. They give a shit about answering to shareholders and that is what it boils down to.

I think it's a matter of "who's who'', and Imus really wasn't anybody when it was all said and done.

He had a contract worth $50 million and his show generated $15 million per year on adverts and fee's alone. How then can you say he was a nobody?!?!?

 

[Tony]

I am glad Imus got fired. He was talking about a team of "black" collegiate basketball players when he said "nappy headed" hoes. Asian, White, Hispanic women don't have "nappy" hair. Only black people have nappy hair. Most of us can't run a comb through our hair without some kind of chemicals/grease in it. Other races can run a comb right through. And to me "nappy head" is racists if you ask me because only black people have nappy hair.

And it's pretty stupid of anyone to compare Imus' statements to rap lyrics. Like Snoop Dogg said... when they (rappers) mention bitches and hoes they're talking about women in the hood (hood rats) that are out to get cats for their money. Rappers don't refer to collegiate basketball players as bitches, hoes, etc...

You know how the saying goes "if the shoes fits wear it". If you're not a bitch or a hoe then the rappers aren't talking about you. And don't forget what Too Short said back in the day "all bitches ain't women".

 

[ParkBoyz]

^Good points..

 

[|GOD|||ZILLA|]

i don't' even know why you guys still talkin' 'bout this shit.. if anyone is standin' up for imus.. they racist... period.

 

[T-Spoon]

I am glad Imus got fired. He was talking about a team of "black" collegiate basketball players when he said "nappy headed" hoes. Asian, White, Hispanic women don't have "nappy" hair. Only black people have nappy hair. Most of us can't run a comb through our hair without some kind of chemicals/grease in it. Other races can run a comb right through. And to me "nappy head" is racists if you ask me because only black people have nappy hair.

And it's pretty stupid of anyone to compare Imus' statements to rap lyrics. Like Snoop Dogg said... when they (rappers) mention bitches and hoes they're talking about women in the hood (hood rats) that are out to get cats for their money. Rappers don't refer to collegiate basketball players as bitches, hoes, etc...

You know how the saying goes "if the shoes fits wear it". If you're not a bitch or a hoe then the rappers aren't talking about you. And don't forget what Too Short said back in the day "all bitches ain't women".

and there u have it cmoke. perfect answer.

when rappers talk about bitches and hoes, they're talkin about BITCHES AND HOES.

is that basketball team a group of "nappy headed hoes"?

fuccin cmoke always talkin bout a double standard, at least u don't have to deal with racism from people that are IN POWER. fold.

 

[T-Spoon]

oh yeah, imus DESERVED to get fired, i'm glad he got fired, fucc him. fold.