McGregor vs Mayweather 8/26/17

  • Wanna Join? New users you can now register lightning fast using your Facebook or Twitter accounts.
B

battle619

Sicc OG
#203
Feb 10, 2006
2,018
982
113
42
#203
Foul Mouth said:
Conor aint got the best cardio. he only went 3 rounds once. he went 5 rounds once. but he also kicks a lot and that takes more energy than punching. i was thinkin he wouldnt be able to go 12 but i think he could do 12 now, maybe. thats cus in a 3 round mma fight, you only get 2 breaks. and your fighting for 5 minutes. a 15 minute boxing match you get 4 breaks and your fighting for 3 minutes. so i dont doubt anymore than Conor can go 12 boxing. unless he constantly throws punches that dont connect which will drain him. if he's missing that much, then that means Floyd is fucking Conor up and Conor gets stopped.

as far as dehydration, every mma fighter cuts. Mayweather seemed surprised this week talkin bout McGregor gonna miss weight but maybe he just didnt understand that aspect. technical skill is what you want in an mma fight, but strength means a lot if your fighting someone strong with good muay thai clinch and/or good wrestling. so everybody cuts. Conor weighed in at 153, talkin bout he gonna weigh around 170 on fight night. probably true. at least probably 165. that strength doesnt do much good in boxing since clinch work is one of them things thats iffy anyway. in mma there might not always be a takedown but they'll always be a clinch. Conor aint even a real clinch typa dude like that so the ropes are irrelevent. he clinches more when he gets hurt, but he doesn't get hurt enough to do that much at all. he doesnt punch to get into a clinch like Ghost. difference is Ghost fights into a clinch with the intentions of fucking you up in the clinch. thats different than Floyd who fights into a clinch when he's hurt or to rest. or he fights into a clinch so he can reset.

only reason i even brought up anything about clinch is cus how Mayweather uses the clinch. Ghost took Berto to the ropes with clinches and i dont see how McGregor could have better technique than Ghost at clinching into and on the ropes. i do think tho that McGregor might have something to offer in the middle of the ring. and if anything, i can see Mayweather trying out Conor's clinch vs Conor searchin for one.

also Ghost probably took the first 2 rounds til Mayweather figured him out. Ghost is pretty traditional and it still took Mayweather some rounds to not get hit. if McGregor starts getting lit up the first round then he'll probably get stopped or played with for 12 rounds. McGregor dont move like a boxer. it aint just his stance. its how he moves his torso with that stance. you can look at his feet when he throws certain punches and see "bad boxing technique", but those "correct" techniques are read by good boxers. you see some feet doin some other shit your not used to you might calculate wrong. you also see the torso moving a different way you might miscalculate. thats how he fights in mma, takeaway any clinching or kicks. thats why his hands are good. he dont sleep anybody like he and UFC claims. to me sleeping is boxing sleeping. sleepin by the time you hit the floor and ref aint even gotta count. Conor puts people to sleep by beating their head when their on the floor. but he's good enough with the hands to get them down there. best he can do as a boxer is probably tko.

Mayweather's the exception tho so we'll see if he makes Conor's style look foolish.
Click to expand...
You asked me how Conor would do amongst Floyd's 10 previous fighters. His weakest was the Ghost and that's why I brought him up. The Ghost's style will kill Conor. The Ghost was a southpaw too! If you are talking about clinching Floyd doesn't clinch to rest, nor to reset. He does it after he tallies up his punches, kill time, and so he won't get hit. He really didn't hold vs Maidana the first time, Canelo, or even Cotto. Floyd almost dropped Cotto not because of his power but because Cotto couldn't hang with Floyd anymore. He got weak and he almost got dropped in the 12th. That's why boxing fans are saying Conor will get tired and possibly get dropped by Floyd. Because the conditioning and technique is more demanding than it is in MMA.

And the movements of the body doesn't mean shit if you can't connect and Conor's punches are too wide. Let's say Conor really did hurt Paulie... then why couldn't he finish him? Paulie is beyond out of shape and has no power. Paulie was there to help Conor, not hurt. But once he saw what Conor was trying to do he left. Conor caught Paulie while Paulie tried the shell. When was the last time you seen Paulie fight in a shell? Of course he's gonna get caught.

So, how do YOU think Conor would do vs Canelo, Cotto, or Maidana. Berto was Mayweathers' second weakest fighter and Berto has over 20 ko's under his belt. That's pretty good punching power. How would Conor do vs him?
 
infinity

infinity

( o )( o )
#204
May 4, 2005
16,189
64,829
113
37
UOENO, CA
#204
Props: Face-Me and Face-Me
T-Spoon

T-Spoon

Sicc OG
#205
Apr 26, 2002
3,897
638
113
#205
Foul Mouth said:
all mma fans and Conor fans ever say is he has power in his left. thats a shallow argument and only good enough for a punches chance. i think its his movement that makes the power work. might not work against Floyd but i'd like to see it against someone not Floyd in boxing.
Click to expand...
You nailed it. Someone broke it down one time, I forgot who, but he said the same thing as you. Something along the lines as, he's a southpaw, and he cuts the ring REAL well. He also uses his kiccs to set up while he's cutting off. Pushing his opponent to his left. They basically walk into a STRAIGHT left. Mind you, a STRAIGHT left, not a left hook. And he has their body positioned jus right to where that straight left hits that sweet spot on that jaw-STRAIGHT. I'll see if I can find his article. It's been a minute, but it was something along the lines of that.
 
F

Foul Mouth

Sicc OG
#207
Apr 25, 2002
6,229
2,453
113
#207
battle619 said:
You asked me how Conor would do amongst Floyd's 10 previous fighters. His weakest was the Ghost and that's why I brought him up. The Ghost's style will kill Conor. The Ghost was a southpaw too! If you are talking about clinching Floyd doesn't clinch to rest, nor to reset. He does it after he tallies up his punches, kill time, and so he won't get hit. He really didn't hold vs Maidana the first time, Canelo, or even Cotto. Floyd almost dropped Cotto not because of his power but because Cotto couldn't hang with Floyd anymore. He got weak and he almost got dropped in the 12th. That's why boxing fans are saying Conor will get tired and possibly get dropped by Floyd. Because the conditioning and technique is more demanding than it is in MMA.

And the movements of the body doesn't mean shit if you can't connect and Conor's punches are too wide. Let's say Conor really did hurt Paulie... then why couldn't he finish him? Paulie is beyond out of shape and has no power. Paulie was there to help Conor, not hurt. But once he saw what Conor was trying to do he left. Conor caught Paulie while Paulie tried the shell. When was the last time you seen Paulie fight in a shell? Of course he's gonna get caught.

So, how do YOU think Conor would do vs Canelo, Cotto, or Maidana. Berto was Mayweathers' second weakest fighter and Berto has over 20 ko's under his belt. That's pretty good punching power. How would Conor do vs him?
Click to expand...
your right that Floyd clinches after tallying up punches. thats strategy. thats defensive clinching. he doesnt clinch to beat you up. he points you up then clinches so he wont get hit, ref breaks it, Floyds reset. if you hurt him, he'll try and grab you, to rest and not get hit. he kills time regardless if he clinchin defensively or if he hurt. he tries to control 3 minutes at a time.

the Paulie vids dont make me think any way. you cant see shit. i know Conor fans might tell you different but im not that typa fan.

everybody you mention i give McGregor the upper hand. thats assuming he uses his fight stance. reason being is them fighters have to all train for Conor, not an mma fighter and not a boxer. Conor has to train for a boxer, then small subtle differences between them. all them dudes would have to train for something that they've never seen. and its not some Tank Abbot lookin bar fighter. its a real fighter. technical as fuck but the technique looks foreign to boxers. shit was foreign as fuck to Nate Diaz and he's fought a gang of fighters.

you can say its a different sport and all but you cant say its a running back in a basketball game or a ping pong player in a tennis match. boxing has been in the UFC since litterly #1. you cant compare Coutour vs Toney to this. those weren't just 2 different sports, they were 2 different limited styles. old school shit in mma years. McGregor woulda had problems with Coutour and McGregor aint garbage on the ground.
 
F

Foul Mouth

Sicc OG
#208
Apr 25, 2002
6,229
2,453
113
#208
even though id put McGregor slightly over everybody you named, for the reasons givin, that dont mean i give him the advantage over Floyd. i just know what McGregor brings to a boxing match.
 
2-0-Sixx

2-0-Sixx

Sicc OG
#210
May 13, 2002
49,944
47,800
113
43
Seattle
www.socialistworld.net
#210
Foul Mouth said:
everybody you mention i give McGregor the upper hand. thats assuming he uses his fight stance. reason being is them fighters have to all train for Conor, not an mma fighter and not a boxer. Conor has to train for a boxer, then small subtle differences between them. all them dudes would have to train for something that they've never seen. and its not some Tank Abbot lookin bar fighter. its a real fighter. technical as fuck but the technique looks foreign to boxers. shit was foreign as fuck to Nate Diaz and he's fought a gang of fighters.
Click to expand...
How could you possibly give him the upper hand against Canelo and Cotto? You talk about them having to train for something they've never seen, but Conor would be in the ring against technical skills he's never seen, nor had to deal with. Ever. These are elite boxers, the best of the best, which Conor has never had to fight in a boxing ring. It's easier for the elite professional boxers to deal with an amateur unorthodox style than the amateur having to deal with the elite pro.

You mentioned that training for boxers is simpler because it's just small subtle differences between them. Which I don't think is true first off, try training for Floyd and then a guy like Maidana. It's such a different type of fight. But still, those small subtle differences you mention are simply because punching is the only weapon. Conor himself has to abide by that, so whatever amazing flowing movement he has, in the end he's still going to have to do exactly the same thing as his opponent - throw punches. So it becomes then, who is the better skilled throwing punching guy (also known as "boxing").

I think it will really show tomorrow if Floyd wants to embarrass him. If he just stands in the pocket the entire time, which he says he's going to do, he'll get a KO but he'll probably also make Conor look competent for a couple rounds simply due to Floyd making himself more available if nothing else, which Floyd has done a lot more in his advanced age. But if Floyd really wants to put on a number and embarrass him, he'll use movement as well.

Guys like Canelo and Cotto are so unbelievably technically sound, that they can exploit simple things like having a bad stance, leading with the wrong foot, over extending, missing a power shot, etc., they can punish his body and head. It wouldn't be pretty in either situation.

If Conor wants to use a wide karate stance, it's not as if boxers have never seen a wide sideways stance before and will self destruct because they won't know what to do. Some guys in boxing use very wide stances, some have different backgrounds in kickboxing or whatever and some guys are just weird and unorthodox as fuck. These guys like Cotto all go through years of amateur boxing on the international level and see it all, on the highest levels, and learn how to handle it and weaknesses they can exploit. Of course Conor can do some movements that are different, but in Boxing it still boils down to throwing punches and timing. It won't take much to see what Conor is made of and he'll realize rather sooner or later that timing in boxing against an elite boxer, when punches are the only weapons you have, is completely different than in MMA which is just so different for a number of reasons.

I don't think it gives nearly enough credit to guys like Cotto and Canelo, who are incredibly skilled boxers, to give the upper hand to a guy who you've never seen box professionally before, or to the sport to suggest they wouldn't have the upperhand, simply because Conor "is a fighter" and will do things "they've never seen before" (which you haven't even seen yourself either).
 
Props: kane916, kane916, Unk1ne and 3 others
2-0-Sixx

2-0-Sixx

Sicc OG
#212
May 13, 2002
49,944
47,800
113
43
Seattle
www.socialistworld.net
#212
Cheaptimes said:
Hey 2-0-Sixx @2-0-Sixx what website can I get stats on the undercard?
if there is one.
Click to expand...
Boxrec will always list every fight on the event and on the date as well (there are actually well over 100 fights tomorrow, which is typical for a Saturday).

Here is the entire card:
http://boxrec.com/en/event/752960

Gervonta Davis vs Francisco Fonseca
Nathan Cleverly vs Badou Jack
Steve Cunningham vs Andrew Tabiti

These three are the main undercard fights, not sure what else they are showing. Maybe the Thomas Dulorme fight idk. Gervonta Davis is an up and coming star, who Floyd promotes and really wants him to be a big thing but he actually came in overweight, stripped of IBF title. Probably not a big blow anyways since he's a heavy favorite and the fight will go on anyways.


Here are all the fights tomorrow:
http://boxrec.com/en/date?date=2017-08-26

Obviously Miguel Cotto vs Yoshihiro Kamegai is the biggest non-Floyd event.
 
Last edited:
Props: Cheaptimes and Cheaptimes
F

Foul Mouth

Sicc OG
#214
Apr 25, 2002
6,229
2,453
113
#214
2-0-Sixx said:
How could you possibly give him the upper hand against Canelo and Cotto? You talk about them having to train for something they've never seen, but Conor would be in the ring against technical skills he's never seen, nor had to deal with. Ever. These are elite boxers, the best of the best, which Conor has never had to fight in a boxing ring. It's easier for the elite professional boxers to deal with an amateur unorthodox style than the amateur having to deal with the elite pro.

You mentioned that training for boxers is simpler because it's just small subtle differences between them. Which I don't think is true first off, try training for Floyd and then a guy like Maidana. It's such a different type of fight. But still, those small subtle differences you mention are simply because punching is the only weapon. Conor himself has to abide by that, so whatever amazing flowing movement he has, in the end he's still going to have to do exactly the same thing as his opponent - throw punches. So it becomes then, who is the better skilled throwing punching guy (also known as "boxing").

I think it will really show tomorrow if Floyd wants to embarrass him. If he just stands in the pocket the entire time, which he says he's going to do, he'll get a KO but he'll probably also make Conor look competent for a couple rounds simply due to Floyd making himself more available if nothing else, which Floyd has done a lot more in his advanced age. But if Floyd really wants to put on a number and embarrass him, he'll use movement as well.

Guys like Canelo and Cotto are so unbelievably technically sound, that they can exploit simple things like having a bad stance, leading with the wrong foot, over extending, missing a power shot, etc., they can punish his body and head. It wouldn't be pretty in either situation.

If Conor wants to use a wide karate stance, it's not as if boxers have never seen a wide sideways stance before and will self destruct because they won't know what to do. Some guys in boxing use very wide stances, some have different backgrounds in kickboxing or whatever and some guys are just weird and unorthodox as fuck. These guys like Cotto all go through years of amateur boxing on the international level and see it all, on the highest levels, and learn how to handle it and weaknesses they can exploit. Of course Conor can do some movements that are different, but in Boxing it still boils down to throwing punches and timing. It won't take much to see what Conor is made of and he'll realize rather sooner or later that timing in boxing against an elite boxer, when punches are the only weapons you have, is completely different than in MMA which is just so different for a number of reasons.

I don't think it gives nearly enough credit to guys like Cotto and Canelo, who are incredibly skilled boxers, to give the upper hand to a guy who you've never seen box professionally before, or to the sport to suggest they wouldn't have the upperhand, simply because Conor "is a fighter" and will do things "they've never seen before" (which you haven't even seen yourself either).
Click to expand...

your right, its a boxing match. that just means a set of rules with refined stances and movement, rhythm and specifics. im not taking anything from Cotto or Alvarez. its not like i put just any mma fighter and give him the upper hand against Canelo or Cotto so it aint about mma vs boxing. its about styles within a set of rules. prime Cotto would destroy damn near every mma fighter in his weight classes in a fight with boxing rules. reason id have Conor a slight edge is cus Conor's fighting a boxing stance which typically are able to throw certain shots to certain areas. Cotto leaves himself open to counters since he's very aggressive. he got nice footwork and cuts angles while he gives off shots but Conor's lead foot will cut off a lot of space that wouldnt be cut off against other boxers. Conor would have the reach advantage and nice counter work advantage. not sayin Cotto cant beat Conors ass, but if he cant read a foreign style, everything i said would be to Conors advantage.

Canelo has a boxing stance. meaning he has certain punches available to him as a fighter. you dont have to believe that but Floyd does. your feet to your knees to your hips to your torso to your shoulders to your glove position dictate what you can throw. thats why Floyd figures out what your gonna throw before the viewer does. he's the best at that but it takes a little while to compute. Canelo is aggressive so that leads him open to counters, but Canelo can counter Conor too and Canelo might even produce more power. he can probably sleep Conor with a technically clean boxing counter. but Conor's stance and reach and angles would be new especially the counters. Conor also can switch orthodox and southpaw on him to give him problems.

Conor would have the advantage for foot position. his foot extends further front. if a boxer fights for foot position then it seems they're gonna have to keep on backing up.
 
2-0-Sixx

2-0-Sixx

Sicc OG
#215
May 13, 2002
49,944
47,800
113
43
Seattle
www.socialistworld.net
#215
Foul Mouth said:
your right, its a boxing match. that just means a set of rules with refined stances and movement, rhythm and specifics. im not taking anything from Cotto or Alvarez. its not like i put just any mma fighter and give him the upper hand against Canelo or Cotto so it aint about mma vs boxing. its about styles within a set of rules. prime Cotto would destroy damn near every mma fighter in his weight classes in a fight with boxing rules. reason id have Conor a slight edge is cus Conor's fighting a boxing stance which typically are able to throw certain shots to certain areas. Cotto leaves himself open to counters since he's very aggressive. he got nice footwork and cuts angles while he gives off shots but Conor's lead foot will cut off a lot of space that wouldnt be cut off against other boxers. Conor would have the reach advantage and nice counter work advantage. not sayin Cotto cant beat Conors ass, but if he cant read a foreign style, everything i said would be to Conors advantage.

Canelo has a boxing stance. meaning he has certain punches available to him as a fighter. you dont have to believe that but Floyd does. your feet to your knees to your hips to your torso to your shoulders to your glove position dictate what you can throw. thats why Floyd figures out what your gonna throw before the viewer does. he's the best at that but it takes a little while to compute. Canelo is aggressive so that leads him open to counters, but Canelo can counter Conor too and Canelo might even produce more power. he can probably sleep Conor with a technically clean boxing counter. but Conor's stance and reach and angles would be new especially the counters. Conor also can switch orthodox and southpaw on him to give him problems.

Conor would have the advantage for foot position. his foot extends further front. if a boxer fights for foot position then it seems they're gonna have to keep on backing up.
Click to expand...
You are giving Conor all of these advantages without even seeing him box professionally, over elite boxers. You haven't seen what his power is like with 8oz gloves or his speed or even his stamina (it's a different pace with shorter breaks so none of us know how his boxing stamina is). Other than some clips with a shot Paulie in sparring, you're basing all this on his MMA which is totally different.

How do you know Conor switching from southpaw to Orthodox would give Canelo problems? How could you come to that conclusion? Is there a fight where Canelo struggled with a swtich hitter?

Canelo is a boxer-puncher, but a counter puncher by nature. He prefers guys coming to him. He's not very agressive unless his target is a sitting duck.

"Canelo might even produce more power". This isn't even a question since again, this is boxing and in order to have tremendous power like Canelo in this weight class you have to have a lot of experience and good punching technique in boxing with 8oz/10oz gloves. You can't simply assume because Conor has good power in MMA with MMA gloves that it will translate into boxing.

You're saying Conor's wide Boxing stance gives him an edge over Cotto, because his stance makes him "able to throw certain shots to certain areas", you have some examples of this in boxing? All you're saying is about Conor's angles and stance giving Cotto/Canelo problems but that same stance is what will also allow Cotto/Canelo to exploit him. It's not like he's some defensive wizard, we've seen him hit, rocked and hurt:



This is just a little jab by Diaz, who doesn't have a jab like Cotto and Canelo which is a massive weapon in boxing that you haven't even mentioned:


I think you're massively ignoring the technical difficulty involved in boxing, taking what you've seen work for Conor in MMA and make a big assumption that it would work against elite boxers in boxing.

Again, having a wide sideways stance in boxing isn't that unique and a guy like Cotto, an Olympic fighter who fought around the globe with over 200 fights has seen a lot of "foreign" styles. Any elite boxer has similar backgrounds.
 
Props: kane916 and kane916
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom