[MegaThread] Free Will - Do we have it? Can we get it?

  • Wanna Join? New users you can now register lightning fast using your Facebook or Twitter accounts.
Jan 31, 2008
2,794
3,384
113
39
#1
If there is one purpose for my joining this forum it is to make this thread.

Do we have any free will? What IS free will? Is it 'free will' when your actions can only come from a limited set of options? Is it 'free will' when your starting point is a continuation from something that has started so long ago?
Or is it free will when everything you can ever know about a given thing is based on sensory input?

What about the fact that a man's actions are rooted in, what is deemed by some philosophers including Schopenhauer, The Will to Live, and that everything he thinks he does is in reality to serve its agenda?


I will make a bold claim here to get the ball rolling: The advent and the innovation of the internet as a whole has done NOTHING but serve an evolutionary purpose.
 
Jan 31, 2008
2,794
3,384
113
39
#2
From an esoteric perspective:

We exist in a world within worlds and inherit not only the laws that bind our own world, but the laws of the world that our own world exists within, and the laws of the world that that world exists in, and so on.

We are bound by the laws that govern the planet Earth. Its laws and limitations are passed down to us. It is bound by the laws of the solar system which is bound by the laws of the galaxy, etc...

We are here for the purpose of the world that we exist in, and we are here exactly as intended to serve the very purpose we were brought here to serve. As soon as we cease serving this purpose we will be done with.

It is seen as this: even though the cells in your body make up their own world they are here to serve the organism (you). They inherit your own laws and so forth just as you inherit the earth's and so forth.

One cell can cease to serve its purpose(become cancerous) and it will not have an impact on the ecosystem of the host it serves. But if enough become cancerous the host will die.

In the same manner, not all Men can free themselves from the purpose they are here to serve. If enough people do it there would be catastrophic effects on the organism and mankind will be dealt with.
This also includes all men becoming 'self-realized'... Only a few at a time are permitted.

Man is here to serve a function.
 
Last edited:
Jan 31, 2008
2,794
3,384
113
39
#8
Who "you" are is a superstition.

The "I" that is "you", the thing which says "I love" "I hate" "I am so n so" is merely a function of the brain to ensure the survival of the body and the replication of it.
Pay close attention to this thing that you take to be your "I".

First of all, it only exists in a subject-object relationship. Which means it only 'appears' to be a legit thing in relation to an object (I love dogs, I hate cats).
If I ask you to tell me about yourself "I am a man" "I hate trump" etc, remove the objects from your statement until you are left with the subject and then see whether or not it, the I, eludes definition.

Who you think you are, your sense of self AKA your identity is merely the identification with objects.
This is why it is so difficult to get someone to reject something they've identified with, whether it be political stance, religious perspective, outlook on the world, and even things like talking shit about their car or their beliefs. They behave as if you are talking about THEM. And you are because that is all these individuals are.



Just like the heart serves a function for the survival of the organism, as does the brain. One of the functions of the brain is to attribute a sense of self to these thoughts. These thoughts are happening in the same way as digestion happens. The thoughts include the subject-object relationship, but thats all it is-- a function of the brain!

Pay attention to the "I".
One moment it is saying one thing and in the next moment it is saying something completely contradictory to the first. Man is a multitude of I's--we are talking in the thousands.


Right now you can be comfortable and perfectly content. You may even consider the body to be something that you have rather than something that you are. But as soon as the body requires sustenance your ass is quick to proclaim "I AM HUNGRY!"
Or as soon as your body experiences illness you say you are sick, or you are in pain.
You see, just as "you" were used to serve this function of feeding it, "you" are ALWAYS being used to serve the function of its survival, and of the survival of the species.

"YOU" don't really exist as an entity but rather as a function. The strong sense of self is an illusion; a lie; a hallucination.



So what are we really?
 
Last edited:
Jan 31, 2008
2,794
3,384
113
39
#9
I've always admired how ants tend to walk in a straight line. It seems like they are under some sort of spell; a sort of collective ant spell.
And I wonder whether they think they have any free will.

And then one day as I am driving down the freeway, I look around me and...


But I am sure WE are free.. I mean.. we chose to follow the straight path, right?? We must not be under some crazy spell because... i mean.. its us we are talking about here!
 
Jan 31, 2008
2,794
3,384
113
39
#11
If you watch this series pay attention to the language that these kids use. Pay attention to the life that they resign themselves to from a very young age; what kind of life they think they deserve and how low or high they set their expectations.

this is still theater so use your own judgement

'Give me a child until he is 7 and I will show you the man.'
— Aristotle

The Up Series is a series of documentary films produced by Granada Television that have followed the lives of fourteen British children since 1964, when they were seven years old. So far the documentary has had eight episodes spanning 49 years (one episode every seven years) and the documentary has been broadcast on both ITV and BBC. In a 2005 Channel 4 programme, the series topped the list of The 50 Greatest Documentaries.[2] The children were selected to represent the range of socio-economic backgrounds in Britain at that time, with the explicit assumption that each child's social class predetermines their future. Every seven years, the director, Michael Apted, films material from those of the fourteen who choose to participate. The aim of the series is stated at the beginning of 7 Up as: "Why do we bring these children together? Because we want to get a glimpse of England in the year 2000. The shop steward and the executive of the year 2000 are now seven years old."

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LQZpiSfESE&index=1&list=PLTb86Ml_51PonxUmIMQQPSUa2CqWLev9Y[/ame]
 
May 7, 2013
9,708
14,167
113
33°
www.hoescantstopme.biz
#12
Free Will is definitely an illusion.Every move we make and everything we do has already been predetermined. It is predetermined at a molecular level. Right and wrong has nothing to do with it, which is why some are always perceived as making the wrong choice but even when they are talked to by say LEO on the TV show Cops they say they know right from wrong. Again, right and wrong are just as much an illusion as free will. Habits don't exist either. This has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with science. Habits are nothing more than a pattern that is part of the human experience, which is tied to survival against predators.
 
Last edited:
Jan 31, 2008
2,794
3,384
113
39
#13
Free Will is definitely an illusion.Every move we make and everything we do has already been predetermined. It is predetermined at a molecular level. Right and wrong has nothing to do with it, which is why some are always perceived as making the wrong choice but even when they are talked to by say LEO on the TV show Cops they say they know right from wrong. Again, right and wrong are just as much an illusion as free will. Habits don't exist either. This has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with science. Habits are nothing more than a pattern that is part of the human experience, which is tied to survival against predators.
Aww yisss!

What i find interesting is how people take ownership over their heart beating or their hair growing even though our relationship to them is more like their relationship to the grass and trees.
There is a whole lot of self-delusion going on all the time.

The really amazing part to me is that the thing which takes the main focus of our existence, our identity, is absolutely nothing more than a paper thin function of an organ, the brain.
But it is this identity that people spend all of 'their' life protecting and fostering.

This paper thin nonexistence having byproduct of the mind and the unawareness of its nature is why many people have said
"man lacks true self awareness"
"man is a machine"
"man is an animal"
"if you look around you and realize that everyone you see is sleep walking you will shit yourself"

"sleeping people fight wars and sleeping people die in them"

But the very thing that we are negating is being asked to see itself as illegitimate which it can't help but resist fully.
 
Apr 16, 2005
9,061
19,408
113
39
#14
There is no free will. Laws, religion, society, etc. keeps us from making any free decisions. Shitting your diaper and puking on your mum as a baby is the only free will we can enjoy...
 
Apr 4, 2006
1,712
329
0
39
www.myspace.com
#16
If there is one purpose for my joining this forum it is to make this thread.

Do we have any free will? What IS free will? Is it 'free will' when your actions can only come from a limited set of options? Is it 'free will' when your starting point is a continuation from something that has started so long ago?
Or is it free will when everything you can ever know about a given thing is based on sensory input?

What about the fact that a man's actions are rooted in, what is deemed by some philosophers including Schopenhauer, The Will to Live, and that everything he thinks he does is in reality to serve its agenda?


I will make a bold claim here to get the ball rolling: The advent and the innovation of the internet as a whole has done NOTHING but serve an evolutionary purpose.
Of course we have free will (most people at least) if we didn't we would all be sheep, yet those barking the commands would prove that free will is possible because they would be the ones dictating outcomes for their benefit...

If you watch CNN you have no free will, if you live your life based on trends and your actions are dictated by others then you have no free will - or at the very least you reject free will....

But free will exists, going against the grain proves it - I mean I have choices - I could grab my pistol right now and rob the bank across the street but I won't because I'm not stupid and that would be wrong, but the simple fact I have that choice proves we have free will.....

Now, of course there are people out there that believe we live in a "Matrix" and that "free will" is nothing more than an illusion because all of our actions have already been dictated beforehand, so every decision we make appears to be of free will but it's not - it's just what was programmed.. Like for example I was programmed to write this post - not because I wanted to but because it was all part of the program - it was destiny..

I don't buy the "we live in a matrix" bullshit..... I believe we have free will, but I also believe that some people (sheeple) refuse to use or are too scared to use their free will.
 
Last edited: