Mayweather vs Pacquiao May 2nd [official]

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Who wins?


  • Total voters
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May 13, 2002
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#41
I know the MGM pays Mayweather good, but I do wish this fight was somewhere else. I wish Floyd would have done like Ali and fight all over the world. This fight could have been at some insane venues. They're gonna obviously break the gate record either way, but would have added another cool factor if this fight was in a stadium whether it be in Dallas, the UK, South Africa, etc.
 
Sep 20, 2005
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#43
I know the MGM pays Mayweather good, but I do wish this fight was somewhere else. I wish Floyd would have done like Ali and fight all over the world. This fight could have been at some insane venues. They're gonna obviously break the gate record either way, but would have added another cool factor if this fight was in a stadium whether it be in Dallas, the UK, South Africa, etc.

Isn't Vegas the only place that xylocaine is legal anywhere else it would be a banned substance
 
Feb 10, 2006
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#44
One thing I noticed during the GGG fight is when they mentioned the Floyd Manny fight, they didn't put it on their calendar, didn't guarantee the fight will happen, and didn't say it was an HBO/Showtime ppv. Arum and HBO were trying to make more money for both fighters but seem to bank on Manny winning so they can get the replay of the fight. Or they just aren't getting it so they don't care about it as much.
 

HERESY

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Apr 25, 2002
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#45
The most common mistake is people think Mayweather is going to use the Philly Shell against Pacquiao but he never really utilized it in the Zab Judah fight...instead he used the high glove peek a boo style because of Zabs speed. It's a position where he can respond quicker and be more assertive...when it comes to speed fighters like Shane (2nd round Mayweather got caught flush in the shell defense by Mosely) Floyd then came back squared up and dominated Shane. Just like in these pic with Zab...Mayweather rarely used his primary defensive stance...keeping a high guard. I think Mayweather will approach Pacquiao in the same fashion to keep Manny straight in his sights and not make the mistake of turning his back on Pacquaio because Pacquiao can get around him and Floyd may lose track of where Manny is at. The punch you don't see is the punch that can hurt you. Floyd by easy unanimous decision 9 rounds to 3.
i don't think the high guard was used to nullify Zabs speed. I'd say it was used to nullify the jab and measure distance. And Judah can't fight worth shit when moving backwards/retreating so that plays a major role as well. You will also see he switched back and forth from a high guard to a shell from high guard to shell once he figured Zab out. Watch the fight and take note of when he switches up and how close the two were when he did it. Then take note of if he is countering more while in a high guard or in a shell.

If he is straight in front of Pac he is gonna get blasted. Why? He is stationary and a target. If he comes forward at Manny with a high guard (which is usually an angressive stance that allows you to move forward on offense) he is gonna get blasted. Why? Because Manny can fight moving backwards. This fight is going to be closer than a lot of people realize.
 
Mar 18, 2008
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#48
i don't think the high guard was used to nullify Zabs speed. I'd say it was used to nullify the jab and measure distance. And Judah can't fight worth shit when moving backwards/retreating so that plays a major role as well. You will also see he switched back and forth from a high guard to a shell from high guard to shell once he figured Zab out. Watch the fight and take note of when he switches up and how close the two were when he did it. Then take note of if he is countering more while in a high guard or in a shell.

If he is straight in front of Pac he is gonna get blasted. Why? He is stationary and a target. If he comes forward at Manny with a high guard (which is usually an angressive stance that allows you to move forward on offense) he is gonna get blasted. Why? Because Manny can fight moving backwards. This fight is going to be closer than a lot of people realize.

The Philly Shell is susceptible to speed fighters see: Roy Jones vs James Toney. Roy blitz Tony repeatedly and moved around Toney. As soon as Toney made a defensive move off of Jones speed attack Jones shifted to Tony's weak side. That sequence happened throughout the fight. Floyd used the high guard and faded into the Philly Shell here and there but made sure he remained square so Judah wouldn't move around to his backside. That is something Manny can do really well if Floyd angles his body in a 12 o'clock position.

Manny will leap forward and spin to Floyd's side and continue his attack. So Floyd needs to respect Manny's foot speed and keep him in front...work the jab high low. If Manny slows down then Floyd might switch to the shell defense and start to walk manny down. Also Floyd will/ should present Manny with his own movement and box whenever he is not stationary. Floyd can make this an easy fight just like he did Marquez. Manny will not swarm Mayweather once he receives some stiff counters...Bradley had Pacquiao going and I'm looking at Mayweather being better in all phases of the game. Easy work.
 
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Jan 18, 2006
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#49
Im kind of lost, the fight is actually happening theres not much to argue about anymore lol. Of course most of us know who everyone thinks is gonna win as far as the main posters in this section is. Manny has it easy as far as the outcome of the fight is concerned. Hes the underdog and hes already been ko'd so theres not really much worse that can happen for him except disappoint all the Floyd haters. Im still at the point where theres so many built up excuses at this point cuz of both fighters age and other things that it really doesnt matter the outcome when unbiased people look back 20 years from now.
 

HERESY

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Apr 25, 2002
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#50
The Philly Shell is susceptible to speed fighters see: Roy Jones vs James Toney. Roy blitz Tony repeatedly and moved around Toney. As soon as Toney made a defensive move off of Jones speed attack Jones shifted to Tony's weak side. That sequence happened throughout the fight. Floyd used the high guard and faded into the Philly Shell here and there but made sure he remained square so Judah wouldn't move around to his backside. That is something Manny can do really well if Floyd angles his body in a 12 o'clock position.
It's susceptible to speed fighters and suicide when you lack the speed to pull it off i.e. Berto. With Jones and Toney, it's a bit different because Jones wasn't a southpaw. The other thing is you have to basically be planted to pull it off as you need to lean on your foot. So lateral movement is going to play a factor if you're in and out and the person using the shell can't exchange when you're in the pocket. But with left handed fighters it's naturally weak due to where your hands are placed and the opponents lead hand is different.

Manny will leap forward and spin to Floyd's side and continue his attack. So Floyd needs to respect Manny's foot speed and keep him in front...work the jab high low. If Manny slows down then Floyd might switch to the shell defense and start to walk manny down.
Which side? And he doesn't need to leap and spin. All he needs to do is keep his lead foot to the outside (watch the Zab fight again and take note of where Zabs feet are when he has any success.) Also, if he works the jab high and low then he is at the disadvantage because he's open to a left hook or lead. And if Pac does slow down, which I can see happening, then he should only use the shell when they are inside the pocket. To get close to the guy? Hell no. All Pac has to do, from that distance, is throw the left while Floyd is coming in using that stance.

Also Floyd will/ should present Manny with his own movement and box whenever he is not stationary. Floyd can make this an easy fight just like he did Marquez. Manny will not swarm Mayweather once he receives some stiff counters...Bradley had Pacquiao going and I'm looking at Mayweather being better in all phases of the game. Easy work.
JMM and Pac are two different fighters, bro. Two completely different styles. And Bradley never had Pac going in either fight. When 80+ credible sports outlets have you ahead, and only two have the other guy ahead, and there is a general consensus in the boxing community that a robbery has occurered, then it's most likely the other guy didn't do shit.

This fight is going to be closer than you guys think.
 
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Mar 18, 2008
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#51
Yeah it would be lol. Probably impossible to do since he's done it his way his entire life and obviously that wouldn't work against 95% of fighters
He meant switch to southpaw using the Philly Shell in reverse for the Manny fight only...not 95% of the other fighters who are orthodox. But like you stated you don't do something as dramatic a change as that especially against an opponent as talented as Pacquiao....Floyd will square up with a high guard.
 

Coach E. No

Jesus es Numero Uno
Mar 30, 2013
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#52
Yeah it would be lol. Probably impossible to do since he's done it his way his entire life and obviously that wouldn't work against 95% of fighters
If you're not used to doing it in a southpaw stance, I suppose it could be difficult but it's just as effective against an orthodox fighter if done correctly. But why would Floyd even do that? lol
 

CZAR

Sicc OG
Aug 25, 2003
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#53
Ok so lets be clear about this. Alot of folks said Floyd was scared and would never make the fight and that Manny would knock his out. So now that the fight is here who do yall think will win? I really wanna hear from the haters who said before the fight was made that Floyd would lose and be scared to take the fight. Do yall still feel that way? Just want it to be known up front so no excuses afterwards. Got Em!!
 
Mar 18, 2008
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#54
It's susceptible to speed fighters and suicide when you lack the speed to pull it off i.e. Berto. With Jones and Toney, it's a bit different because Jones wasn't a southpaw. The other thing is you have to basically be planted to pull it off as you need to lean on your foot. So lateral movement is going to play a factor if you're in and out and the person using the shell can't exchange when you're in the pocket. But with left handed fighters it's naturally weak due to where your hands are placed and the opponents lead hand is different.



Which side? And he doesn't need to leap and spin. All he needs to do is keep his lead foot to the outside (watch the Zab fight again and take note of where Zabs feet are when he has any success.) Also, if he works the jab high and low then he is at the disadvantage because he's open to a left hook or lead. And if Pac does slow down, which I can see happening, then he should only use the shell when they are inside the pocket. To get close to the guy? Hell no. All Pac has to do, from that distance, is throw the left while Floyd is coming in using that stance.



JMM and Pac are two different fighters, bro. Two completely different styles. And Bradley never had Pac going in either fight. When 80+ credible sports outlets have you ahead, and only two have the other guy ahead, and there is a general consensus in the boxing community that a robbery has occurered, then it's most likely the other guy didn't do shit.

This fight is going to be closer than you guys think.
Floyd doesn't want to get caught on his weak side like Toney did with Roy...Pacquiao's natural movement as a south paw makes it easier for him than Roy to go in the weak side direction against a Philly Shell defense. In a Philly Shell if Pacquiao gets his lead foot outside of Floyd's lead Manny will shift to Floyd's weak side (his back) and Maywaether will lose track of Pacquaio. So Mayweather will use the peek a boo style, square up and take his chances to keep Manny in his sights. For the record I never stated this will "nullify" Pacquiao's speed only that Floyd has a better "read" on Pac's movement. Floyd would position his weak side directly "behind" him not on the "side"...this will make it harder for Manny to maneuver around to it. Unlike Toney who could not stop Jones from jumping in Floyd is taller...longer...and will use the jab to "control" or "limit" Pacquiao's advances, shooting the jab high and low.

The only reason I used Marquez in comparison to Pacquiao is that he, Manny, will be as easy a fight as the Marquez cake walk. Yes the fight differently like Guerrero is different from Canelo who is deferent than Mosley but the result is the same...Floyd by landslide. Manny won't even stun Floyd...so...easy work.

 
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#55
He meant switch to southpaw using the Philly Shell in reverse for the Manny fight only...not 95% of the other fighters who are orthodox. But like you stated you don't do something as dramatic a change as that especially against an opponent as talented as Pacquiao....Floyd will square up with a high guard.
I know that's what I was saying. I was just saying 95% of boxers are orthodox in general, which is why you never see the Philly shell defense from a southpaw stance, it wouldn't make any sense in boxing. That's why I agreed and laughed saying yeah it would be pretty crazy if Floyd could pull something like that off (he won't, it's too radical of a change like you said). Would be a mistake like Hagler fighting the first four rounds against Leonard southpaw just because his ego/confidence.
 

HERESY

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Apr 25, 2002
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#56
Floyd doesn't want to get caught on his weak side like Toney did with Roy...Pacquiao's natural movement as a south paw makes it easier for him than Roy to go in the weak side direction against a Philly Shell defense. In a Philly Shell if Pacquiao gets his lead foot outside of Floyd's lead Manny will shift to Floyd's weak side (his back) and Maywaether will lose track of Pacquaio.
He won't need to get behind Floyd. If his foot is already to the outside he can pretty much fire any punch at will and land while avoiding most shots. This is why it's problematic for a orthodox fighter when they are fighting a southpaw. And with Toney and Jones, again, that was simply a case of Jones knowing how to combat the style. Things would be even worse if Jones was a southpaw.

So Mayweather will use the peek a boo style, square up and take his chances to keep Manny in his sights. For the record I never stated this will "nullify" Pacquiao's speed only that Floyd has a better "read" on Pac's movement. Floyd would position his weak side directly "behind" him not on the "side"...this will make it harder for Manny to maneuver around to it. Unlike Toney who could not stop Jones from jumping in Floyd is taller...longer...and will use the jab to "control" or "limit" Pacquiao's advances, shooting the jab high and low.
Again, Toney was simply beaten by Jones because Jones understood the stance he was fighting against. The shell is naturally weak against a southpaw stance because of where the arms and feet are placed. So basically if an orthodox fighter is already at a disadvantage when fighting a southpaw he is at a bigger disadvantage when using the shell. Why? Hand placement and foot placement. However, INSIDE, it's going to be a different story.

And again, the jab is already nullified by the left hook or lead. He shoots a jab from a high guard he's still open to the left hook and lead. That's just the disadvantage of fighting a southpaw. Can it be remedied? Absolutely. Watch how he used the jab against Judah and pay attention to where he is when he throws and how far it goes out when he throws. Then see what he does after he throws. Basically it's a fuckin trap. You remember that thread where you spoke about Duran? Well in that thread I said Pac was similar and also said how both Pac and Floyd, amongst a couple of other fighters, have the ability to transition from offense to defense and it fools the people they are fighting. So while you're thinking the high guard is a defensive stance, when Floyd does it, it's to trick you, find distance and set you up for a combo or two. Watch the Judah fight. It's textbook.

The only reason I used Marquez in comparison to Pacquiao is that he, Manny, will be as easy a fight as the Marquez cake walk. Yes the fight differently like Guerrero is different from Canelo who is deferent than Mosley but the result is the same...Floyd by landslide. Manny won't even stun Floyd...so...easy work.

Pimp, this is a harder fight. In fact, I will say that Manny is the best opponent Floyd has fought. This is not going to be a shutout, landslide, etc. This is going to be a close fight and don't be surprised if there is some controversy afterwards. Would I give the edge to Floyd? Yes. He hasn't taken as much damage, he knows how to pace himself, doesn't waste punches and is a sight to behold. People say his fights are boring, I don't think so. I think the guy is a fuckin wizard. I like when he dodges punches and one minute he is in your face and the next he is clear on the other side of the ring. But...Manny has nothing to lose. His ko to Marquez don't mean shit now, he's recovered. Tyson took a beating at the hands of Douglas. Klitscko took a beating at the hands of Lewis. Hearns was crucified by Hagler. Leonard damn near lost an eye. Shit happens. Close fight, I give the edge to Floyd but don't know who will win.
 
May 13, 2002
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#57
Anyone else think this fight is closer now than it was 5 years ago? I know both fighters have slowed down, and clearly Manny has slowed down more than Floyd. But the experience of being KO'd makes Manny a more careful fighter, and perhaps he feels more like he has nothing at all to lose. Floyd has everything to lose in this fight, and with everyone saying he's going to dominate, not much to win unless he can KO Manny.

I think it's a going to be a closer fight than most think.
 
Mar 18, 2008
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#58
When you use the word "Again" to begin your response I'm not sure if that is in disagreement or you are "in" agreement with the statement or statements I had made.

He won't need to get behind Floyd. If his foot is already to the outside he can pretty much fire any punch at will and land while avoiding most shots. This is why it's problematic for a orthodox fighter when they are fighting a southpaw. And with Toney and Jones, again, that was simply a case of Jones knowing how to combat the style. Things would be even worse if Jones was a southpaw.
I said the same thing^^^^

Originally Posted by The Bay Area
Floyd doesn't want to get caught on his weak side like Toney did with Roy...Pacquiao's natural movement as a south paw makes it easier for him than Roy to go in the weak side direction against a Philly Shell defense. In a Philly Shell if Pacquiao gets his lead foot outside of Floyd's lead Manny will shift to Floyd's weak side (his back) and Maywaether will lose track of Pacquiao.

Again, Toney was simply beaten by Jones because Jones understood the stance he was fighting against. The shell is naturally weak against a southpaw stance because of where the arms and feet are placed. So basically if an orthodox fighter is already at a disadvantage when fighting a southpaw he is at a bigger disadvantage when using the shell. Why? Hand placement and foot placement. However, INSIDE, it's going to be a different story.
Okay this is fairly obvious...no disagreement there--->Again, Toney was simply beaten by Jones because Jones understood the stance he was fighting against. See diagram of Jones vs Toney

And again, the jab is already nullified by the left hook or lead. He shoots a jab from a high guard he's still open to the left hook and lead. That's just the disadvantage of fighting a southpaw. Can it be remedied? Absolutely. Watch how he used the jab against Judah and pay attention to where he is when he throws and how far it goes out when he throws. Then see what he does after he throws. Basically it's a fuckin trap. You remember that thread where you spoke about Duran? Well in that thread I said Pac was similar and also said how both Pac and Floyd, amongst a couple of other fighters, have the ability to transition from offense to defense and it fools the people they are fighting. So while you're thinking the high guard is a defensive stance, when Floyd does it, it's to trick you, find distance and set you up for a combo or two. Watch the Judah fight. It's textbook.
And again, the jab is already nullified by the left hook or lead...what's the point? You say Floyd's jab is "nullified" by Juda's southpaw stance...then your following statement tells us how Floyd successfully "jabbed" Judah? It's not nullified if you have success...which Floyd did.

Pimp, this is a harder fight. In fact, I will say that Manny is the best opponent Floyd has fought. This is not going to be a shutout, landslide, etc. This is going to be a close fight and don't be surprised if there is some controversy afterwards. Would I give the edge to Floyd? Yes. He hasn't taken as much damage, he knows how to pace himself, doesn't waste punches and is a sight to behold. People say his fights are boring, I don't think so. I think the guy is a fuckin wizard. I like when he dodges punches and one minute he is in your face and the next he is clear on the other side of the ring. But...Manny has nothing to lose. His ko to Marquez don't mean shit now, he's recovered. Tyson took a beating at the hands of Douglas. Klitscko took a beating at the hands of Lewis. Hearns was crucified by Hagler. Leonard damn near lost an eye. Shit happens. Close fight, I give the edge to Floyd but don't know who will win.
Floyd is preparing for his next fight in September 2015 49-0
 

HERESY

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#59
When you use the word "Again" to begin your response I'm not sure if that is in disagreement or you are "in" agreement with the statement or statements I had made.
Depends on where it is used.

I said the same thing^^^^

Originally Posted by The Bay Area
Floyd doesn't want to get caught on his weak side like Toney did with Roy...Pacquiao's natural movement as a south paw makes it easier for him than Roy to go in the weak side direction against a Philly Shell defense. In a Philly Shell if Pacquiao gets his lead foot outside of Floyd's lead Manny will shift to Floyd's weak side (his back) and Maywaether will lose track of Pacquiao.
You did. The problem however is the "weak side" is not "his back." If his lead foot is already on the outside then it's a wrap no matter what stance Floyd is in.
The advantage goes to the southpaw. No extra movement required, fire away at will.

Okay this is fairly obvious...no disagreement there--->Again, Toney was simply beaten by Jones because Jones understood the stance he was fighting against. See diagram of Jones vs Toney

And again, the jab is already nullified by the left hook or lead...what's the point? You say Floyd's jab is "nullified" by Juda's southpaw stance...then your following statement tells us how Floyd successfully "jabbed" Judah? It's not nullified if you have success...which Floyd did.
No, I never said that his jab was nullified by Judah's southpaw stance. Jabbing against a southpaw leaves you open if you're orthodox. However there are ways to get around that, which Floyd did, but it wasn't the jab how you are describing it. Again, where is Floyd when he throws it? How far away is Judah, how far does the jab go? He is using the jab as a trap and to gauge not to do what you are saying, which is, jab high and jab low from a high guard and you will have victory. No way. And guess what? Manny also has a way to counter that trap. Parry the jab with the right hand and move to the right. If he does that he is clearly out of range from being hit with a right hand but he is still in position to throw his left and connect.

Floyd is preparing for his next fight in September 2015 49-0
Doubt it. The man is a pro and understands no one is to be overlooked. No one is to be spared and you cant take a shortcut. Floyd has trained, and trained hard, for every single fight so don't discredit him like that bro.
 

Coach E. No

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Mar 30, 2013
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#60
Ok so lets be clear about this. Alot of folks said Floyd was scared and would never make the fight and that Manny would knock his out. So now that the fight is here who do yall think will win? I really wanna hear from the haters who said before the fight was made that Floyd would lose and be scared to take the fight. Do yall still feel that way? Just want it to be known up front so no excuses afterwards. Got Em!!
I have thought that Floyd would win EASILY for the last 5 years, or whenever this fight was first being discussed. I think the fight is as even as it's ever been though because Floyd's legs aren't what they were and Manny's old strength of being able to rattle off combinations has actually changed to a style that I believe is still difficult to figure out and his one punch speed is as fast as anyone's in the game.

I picked Manny on the poll solely based on the situation that if the fight is close, I have a feeling that judges would favor Manny coming forward for most of the fight, throwing more punches, and people just hate Floyd lol Floyd has managed to never lose to a bad decision, wouldn't be surprised if this is the first time even if he wins clearly. My mind says Floyd, gut says Pacquiao.