If every one followed the bible.. wouldn't the world be a better place?

[Mi$ta-Murda187]

I was thinking that if everyone in the whole world followed the bible..

There would be no killing, hate, aids, murder, greed hunger etc.

No there would still be aging and death... But a lot of other problems like war would not exist.

I'm not saying the world would be better if we were all one religion...
but if everyone followed the morals in the bible..
lots of problems could be avoided...

what do you think?

 

[Tall T]

I think alot of things would be easier if you looked at them like...
'If you follow these rules, everything will be perfect'
...If your a christian than you know all people sin... an even if not its pretty obvious you cant always do the right thing... so its pretty much impossible to even think about that, no matter what beliefs u may be.

 

[HERESY]

If everyone interpreted it the same way, and the interpretation was a good one I could see it happening. But a lot of the morals presented in the bible ar enot exclusive to it, but you already summed it up with the one religion comment. But I feel you. If everyone waited until marriage before they had sex, would you have as many std's, teen pregnancies, rapes etc? No. If everyone loved their fellow man like they were a brother or themselves would the prisons be filled? No. Would we have a large poverty rate? No.

 

[2-0-Sixx]

Sure. The same could be said about any other religion or philosophy. "If everyone would have followed David Koresh, the world would be a better place." If everyone was a Nazi, the world would be a better place."

 

[HERESY]

Sure. The same could be said about any other religion or philosophy. "If everyone would have followed David Koresh, the world would be a better place."

But this man was immoral.

If everyone was a Nazi, the world would be a better place."

Sure. Kill all niggers, kikes, chinks, spics and any person that isn't blonde with blue eyes.

 

[ThaG]

The answer is no and here is why:

While the morals and the type of behaviour proposed by the Bible themselves are not a bad thing there are a lot of things there that are simply not true and which stop the progress of humanity; if everybody followed it we would be still in the Middle Ages (which is actually why the Middle Ages lasted for so long - because a lot of people then followed the Bible)

One of the underlying principles in the Bible is anthropocentrism - the idea that human is the center of the universe (that's why God made man similar to himself - actually it was the opposite that happened but anyway); that type of thinking can only lead us to a catastrophe and this is hapening right now in front of eyes - the destruction of nature and environment

This would still happen, even if people were just as good as the Bible wants them to be, simply because the Bible tells them that they are superior to the other species and can explote them how want and that they are not responsible for anything that happens with the planet overall

Moreover, it is very naive to think people could ever follow the Bible's morals, as good as they might seem; whoever wrote the Bible obviously didn't understand how impossible to apply these morals were

Communism was also a very good thing in theory but it became a disaster because of the people who were implementing it

The only good world I can imagine is a sparsely populated world of highly educated atheists, most of them working in science and technology, without any politicians. Do you know how much progress would we have made in finding alternative energy sources if the money for the war in Iraq were given for research? The war wouldn't be needed then. Anyway, such a world is impossible

The reason we have STD's, teen pregrnancies, rapes etc is that people are ignorant and irresponsible and they are ignorant and irresponsible because of the collapse of the educational system which in turn leads to collaps of "family values" (ignorant and irresponsible persons tend to produce more ignorant and irresponsible)

Only when knowledge and education become a value, then these problems will be solved

 

[Mike Manson]

@ Heresy - Spain, Italy, Japan etc. were all affiliated with the Nazi's and they are not really blond or have blue eyes. I'm not even gonna start talkin about the middle east affiliates. I'm not saying that the world would be a better place though...

Anyway, I think Buddhism would take the number one spot in this discussion!

 

[2-0-NINE]

Passion of the Christ>Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon by a mile!!!!

 

[HERESY]

While the morals and the type of behaviour proposed by the Bible themselves are not a bad thing there are a lot of things there that are simply not true and which stop the progress of humanity

We are talking about the morality not what some people believe may or may not be true.

if everybody followed it we would be still in the Middle Ages (which is actually why the Middle Ages lasted for so long - because a lot of people then followed the Bible)

I can attribute the middle ages lasting long because of the lack of certain technologies and not the bible. Also, on what grounds are you claiming if everyone followed it we would still be in teh middle ages? Everyone didn't follow it during the middle ages, so what is your point?

One of the underlying principles in the Bible is anthropocentrism - the idea that human is the center of the universe (that's why God made man similar to himself - actually it was the opposite that happened but anyway); that type of thinking can only lead us to a catastrophe and this is hapening right now in front of eyes - the destruction of nature and environment

Some people interpret it that way, but some also believe that God is the center of the universe and that he is more important than man. The bible states that while man does have dominion, man is to be a good steward over the land and animals. Again, on what grounds are you making these claims?

This would still happen, even if people were just as good as the Bible wants them to be, simply because the Bible tells them that they are superior to the other species and can explote them how want and that they are not responsible for anything that happens with the planet overall

The bible does not endorse this type of view. Having dominion over something does not mean you have to exploit it or that you are going to exploit it.

Moreover, it is very naive to think people could ever follow the Bible's morals, as good as they might seem; whoever wrote the Bible obviously didn't understand how impossible to apply these morals were

Many people follow the morals presented in the bible, and they are very simple. You can do two of them and practice EVERY SINGLE ONE of them at the exact same time. If it is naive to think people could ever follow the bible that means no one follows the bible....

Also, why do you say the people who wrote it didn't understand how impossible it was to apply these morals? How impossible is to give food to the homeless and take care of the widows? How impossible is it to help someoen if they are on the side of the road, bloody and stomped out?

Communism was also a very good thing in theory but it became a disaster because of the people who were implementing it

Your point?

The only good world I can imagine is a sparsely populated world of highly educated atheists, most of them working in science and technology, without any politicians. Do you know how much progress would we have made in finding alternative energy sources if the money for the war in Iraq were given for research? The war wouldn't be needed then. Anyway, such a world is impossible

This si your opinion and you have the right to it. However, your views are pretty much in accordance with many occultists and neo nazi groups. Population reduction, a world of many atheists and everyone focusing on science and technology.

The reason we have STD's, teen pregrnancies, rapes etc is that people are ignorant and irresponsible and they are ignorant and irresponsible because of the collapse of the educational system which in turn leads to collaps of "family values" (ignorant and irresponsible persons tend to produce more ignorant and irresponsible)

While lack of education, poor life chances, and difficultites derived from ascribed status are factors in teen pregnancy, you have to admit that these things have been going on for thousands of years. However, you can have education all day long, but if there is no threshold you will have the same thing going on except the numbers will be reduced. If everyone is following the morals of teh bible these things would be eliminated because their would be guidelines that are set and implemented. Where are the guidelines in your education program?

Only when knowledge and education become a value, then these problems will be solved

Not true because choice will still be a factor.

 

[HERESY]

@ Heresy - Spain, Italy, Japan etc. were all affiliated with the Nazi's and they are not really blond or have blue eyes. I'm not even gonna start talkin about the middle east affiliates. I'm not saying that the world would be a better place though...

Anyway, I think Buddhism would take the number one spot in this discussion!

How many spaniard nazis, Italian nazis' and Japanese Nazis were in Hitlers inner circle? Part of Nazi teachings places focus on the PURE RACE or the PURE ARYAN RACE. Yes, they have Middle East affiliates (especially in Iran), but do you think these people won't smash on them if their common enemy, "the jew" is defeated?

Next you'll tell me nazis love black people.

 

[2-0-Sixx]

But this man was immoral.

According to who? Morality is subjective. If every one followed this man he wouldn't be considered immoral.

Sure. Kill all niggers, kikes, chinks, spics and any person that isn't blonde with blue eyes.

If we were all Nazi's there wouldn't be any niggers, kikes, chinks, spics and any person that isn't blonde with blue eyes.

 

[2-0-NINE]

So if Morality is subjective, would it be moral for men to sodomize kids, because according to the Leader, it's ok?

 

[HERESY]

According to who? Morality is subjective. If every one followed this man he wouldn't be considered immoral.

Actually, only certain aspects of morality are subjective. You and I both know MURDER is wrong, and this is something that is inherently wrong, across the board. The same can be said for stealing and rape. These things are inherently wrong and wrong in the majority of cultures (if not all) on the planet.

Now if everyone followed him, that doesn't really mean he is immoral. That simply means everyone is following an immoral man, and your statement was, "If everyone would have followed David Koresh, the world would be a better place." , and this is where the problem lies (emphasis added.) There is physical and emotional trauma associated with rape and molestation. Koresh did both, so why would the world be better? You can say, "if rape were allowed it wouldn't be rape", but you still can't remove the physical and emotional impact that comes along with it.

If we were all Nazi's there wouldn't be any niggers, kikes, chinks, spics and any person that isn't blonde with blue eyes.

If we were all nazi's the nazi ideaology and mission would need a serious overhaul which wouldn't make it a "nazi" organization.

 

[ThaG]

We are talking about the morality not what some people believe may or may not be true.

what some people belive is not true can be for the most part scientificalyl proven, if this answers your question

I can attribute the middle ages lasting long because of the lack of certain technologies and not the bible. Also, on what grounds are you claiming if everyone followed it we would still be in teh middle ages? Everyone didn't follow it during the middle ages, so what is your point?

not everyone followed it in the Middle Ages, that's why we got out of them

just to remind you - a lot of the peopel who didn't follow it and who got us out of the Middle Ages ended up burnt (guess by who)

Some people interpret it that way, but some also believe that God is the center of the universe and that he is more important than man. The bible states that while man does have dominion, man is to be a good steward over the land and animals. Again, on what grounds are you making these claims?

correct me if I'm wrong but the bible explicitly says that "God created living creatures and man and told man to rule over all the living creatures"

if this is not enforcing superiro mentality, then what is?

The bible does not endorse this type of view. Having dominion over something does not mean you have to exploit it or that you are going to exploit it.

maybe

but that's what happen in reality

Many people follow the morals presented in the bible, and they are very simple. You can do two of them and practice EVERY SINGLE ONE of them at the exact same time. If it is naive to think people could ever follow the bible that means no one follows the bible....

Also, why do you say the people who wrote it didn't understand how impossible it was to apply these morals? How impossible is to give food to the homeless and take care of the widows? How impossible is it to help someoen if they are on the side of the road, bloody and stomped out?

many people follow the Bible just because there are too god damn people out there

there are also a lot of people who don't follow it and who, according to you, are the reason for all the evil in this world, and the thread was about them

Your point?

I think it's obvious

This si your opinion and you have the right to it. However, your views are pretty much in accordance with many occultists and neo nazi groups. Population reduction, a world of many atheists and everyone focusing on science and technology.

Believe me, I know a lot of people who work in science and technology (I am one of them) and most of them will be considered "good people" even by Bible's standartsand even if not all of them believe in the Bible

My point is that these people are definitely the ones least reposnsible for the catastrophe we're entering, I think the logic is clear to everybody

While lack of education, poor life chances, and difficultites derived from ascribed status are factors in teen pregnancy, you have to admit that these things have been going on for thousands of years. However, you can have education all day long, but if there is no threshold you will have the same thing going on except the numbers will be reduced. If everyone is following the morals of teh bible these things would be eliminated because their would be guidelines that are set and implemented. Where are the guidelines in your education program?

There is education and education. When I say "good education" I don't mean all those morons who graduate from Ivey League schools with diplomas in economics, management and whatever else weak major you can think of, I mean people who REALLY UNDERSTAND THE LAWS OF NATURE and THE REAL PROBLEMS THE WORLD IS FACING; unfotunately they are very few, what I want is to maximize their number, if this happens (it won't, of course), it could make a difference for mankind

Not true because choice will still be a factor.

chocie depends on your mindstate

see above how to put yourself in the proper mindstate to be bale to take responsible decisions

 

[ThaG]

Actually, only certain aspects of morality are subjective. You and I both know MURDER is wrong, and this is something that is inherently wrong, across the board. The same can be said for stealing and rape. These things are inherently wrong and wrong in the majority of cultures (if not all) on the planet.

who said murded is inherently wrong

the way nature functions is based on murder

accept it

not all cultures think murder is wrong, canibals obviously don't

why do you think you opinion is correct and theirs is not?

 

[HERESY]

what some people belive is not true can be for the most part scientificalyl proven, if this answers your question

Again, we are talking about the MORALITY/MORAL TEACHINGS of the bible and NOT what some people believe/don't believe or what science can and can't prove. We are not talking about Noahs Ark, the parting of thE red sea, a fish swallowing a grown man, or a donkey talking to the person who rode it. We are talking about MORALITY, and I don't see teh connection between what you are talking about (stories of the bible) and morality.

not everyone followed it in the Middle Ages, that's why we got out of them

just to remind you - a lot of the peopel who didn't follow it and who got us out of the Middle Ages ended up burnt (guess by who)

What do you mean by "got us out of it"? No one got you out of anything, and there was no mass movement to get anyone out of teh middle ages. Also, people were burnt and sacrificed to many gods all over the world before and after the middle ages. So I guess the bible was the cause of human sacrifice amongst the aztecs, or the cause of Celtic sacrifice...

Not everyone followed in the middle ages, because for the most part, the bible and the READING and INTERPRETATION was controlled by a specific group of people (guess who.)

correct me if I'm wrong but the bible explicitly says that "God created living creatures and man and told man to rule over all the living creatures"

if this is not enforcing superiro mentality, then what is?

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't I just say, "The bible states that while man does have dominion, man is to be a good steward over the land and animals." ?

You are making it seem as if the bible gives man free reign to kill the earth and the animals, and again, on what grounds are you making these claims?

maybe

but that's what happen in reality

No, it isn't a maybe, and if it IS a maybe you are shooting holes in yoru own argument. Again, where are you getting the idea that the bible promotes the idea that man should kill the earth?

many people follow the Bible just because there are too god damn people out there

Huh? Please rephrase that. I don't understand what you're trying to convey here.

there are also a lot of people who don't follow it and who, according to you, are the reason for all the evil in this world, and the thread was about them

Huh? Can someone else translate what this guy is saying? The last two things I quoted make no sense and have no connection to logic or reality.

I think it's obvious

Trust me it isn't.

Believe me, I know a lot of people who work in science and technology (I am one of them) and most of them will be considered "good people" even by Bible's standartsand even if not all of them believe in the Bible

I don't understand what you are trying to convey. Can you please read your statements again and clarify what you're trying to say?

My point is that these people are definitely the ones least reposnsible for the catastrophe we're entering, I think the logic is clear to everybody

Yet these people are responsible for experimenting on animals, creating weapons of mass destruction, and developing products that destroy the ozone layer and contribute to global warming. :dead:

There is education and education. When I say "good education" I don't mean all those morons who graduate from Ivey League schools with diplomas in economics, management and whatever else weak major you can think of, I mean people who REALLY UNDERSTAND THE LAWS OF NATURE and THE REAL PROBLEMS THE WORLD IS FACING; unfotunately they are very few, what I want is to maximize their number, if this happens (it won't, of course), it could make a difference for mankind

What does any of this have to do with you implying that education would reduce the problems derived from premarital sex?

chocie depends on your mindstate

see above how to put yourself in the proper mindstate to be bale to take responsible decisions

You aren't making any sense man.

 

[HERESY]

who said murded is inherently wrong

the way nature functions is based on murder

accept it

not all cultures think murder is wrong, canibals obviously don't

why do you think you opinion is correct and theirs is not?

You obviously don't understand Mala En Se. The way nature functions is not based on MURDER. Killing? Yes, an animal can KILL another animal for food. Do you see deer commiting run by hoovings because one buck has a larger pair of antlers? No you dont.

Accept what? That you are up late at night typing madness because you are either intoxicated, sleepy or have little experience in the english language? Ok, I accept it.

Not all cultures think murder is wrong? Name me ten that don't and canibals are not a "culture" and their emphasis is on EATING people and not murdering them.

Why do I believe my opinion is correct and theirs is not? Who said I believe their opinion is incorrect? What is their opinion?

 

[ThaG]

You obviously don't understand Mala En Se. The way nature functions is not based on MURDER. Killing? Yes, an animal can KILL another animal for food. Do you see deer commiting run by hoovings because one buck has a larger pair of antlers? No you dont.

Accept what? That you are up late at night typing madness because you are either intoxicated, sleepy or have little experience in the english language? Ok, I accept it.

Not all cultures think murder is wrong? Name me ten that don't and canibals are not a "culture" and their emphasis is on EATING people and not murdering them.

Why do I believe my opinion is correct and theirs is not? Who said I believe their opinion is incorrect? What is their opinion?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannibalism_(zoology)

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2003/04/0410_030410_cannibal.html

canibalism was commonspread until very recently in South America, Central Africa and Papua and is still widespread in the latter two, the list of tribes practicing it is long

obviously you have to kill people to eat them

 

[ThaG]

What do you mean by "got us out of it"? No one got you out of anything, and there was no mass movement to get anyone out of teh middle ages. Also, people were burnt and sacrificed to many gods all over the world before and after the middle ages. So I guess the bible was the cause of human sacrifice amongst the aztecs, or the cause of Celtic sacrifice...

Not everyone followed in the middle ages, because for the most part, the bible and the READING and INTERPRETATION was controlled by a specific group of people (guess who.)

the Bible wasn't the cause of human sacrifice amongst the Aztecs but it was a major cause of their extermination (!)

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't I just say, "The bible states that while man does have dominion, man is to be a good steward over the land and animals." ?

[/QUOTE]
You are making it seem as if the bible gives man free reign to kill the earth and the animals, and again, on what grounds are you making these claims?



No, it isn't a maybe, and if it IS a maybe you are shooting holes in yoru own argument. Again, where are you getting the idea that the bible promotes the idea that man should kill the earth?[/QUOTE]

So far it hasn't done much to stop the process either...

my point is not that the bible promotes this particular idea, but rather that it promotes a lot of other ideas which collectively cause the catastrophe, most of which come from pure dogmatism and ignorance[/QUOTE]

Huh? Please rephrase that. I don't understand what you're trying to convey here.

many out of many more isn't that many

Trust me it isn't.

then you have to think over it again...

I don't understand what you are trying to convey. Can you please read your statements again and clarify what you're trying to say?

Yet these people are responsible for experimenting on animals, creating weapons of mass destruction, and developing products that destroy the ozone layer and contribute to global warming. :dead:

it's the people who USE these products who should be blamed...

What does any of this have to do with you implying that education would reduce the problems derived from premarital sex?

very simple - if you:

1. understand how you having 10 children will affect the planet, you won't have 10 children

2. are enitrely focused on proving theorems in abstract algebra, you definitely won't have 10 children

3. know basic biology well enough, you will use condoms

and the list goes on

I have no problems derived from premarital sex, while a lot of otherwise "good christians" have think about it

 

[ThaG]

Accept what? That you are up late at night typing madness because you are either intoxicated, sleepy or have little experience in the english language?

yes, I'm not a native speaker, I hope this will make you a little happier

BTW have you ever thought how many great philosophers have english speaking countries produced and how many came out of Germany for example?

There is an interesting theory that the underlying cause is the simplicity of English compared to the complexity of some of the other languages which develop your brain better suited for abstract thinking

think about it before you insult people you don't know