2-0-Sixx
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Under a communist or socialist system, what is the incentive to take on more responsibility than is required for your job? Why would someone become a brain surgeon if they weren't compensated for their stress?
Also, what is the incentive of coming up with better products and services for the people without competitive business?
Also, what is the incentive of coming up with better products and services for the people without competitive business?
2-0-Sixx wrote:
Under socialism the incentive is different. The incentive to come up with more efficient ways to do things is that we'd have to work less time to do the same amount of work, which means, more free time, vacation, more time for research, etc. "The amount of NECESSARY labor needed to produce the things we NEED."
Under capitalism, the ruling class does everything they can to effect the way we think. Through media, education, religion, etc. we are raised with values of a capitalist system, which is that 'dog eat dog', 'every man for himself' "bling bling" mentality. This isn't human nature, this is something we have been conditioned to think. Or in Marx's explanation - a form of false consciousness.
This kind of mentality doesn't benefit the common man...only the very rich.
This mentality would slowly go away under socialism. Since conditions determine consciousness, new generations would see the world entirely different. Think about when a baby is born. It does not know about race, violence, sexual harassment, being materialistic, greed, etc. it only learns about these things when they are passed down by society.
But in reality self-interest remains under socialism. Workers will form a class consciousness by understanding where their true self-interest lay. The bourgeoisie on the other hand have a self-interest under capitalism, in this case a class interest in controlling the class consciousness of the workers - shoring up the false consciousness of the workers that their self-interest lay with the promotion of the class system (remember the old slogan that what's good for GM is good for America--nationalism is a good tool for propping up false consciousness as is religion).
I don't know, perhaps you should look to Cuba for answers since they produce more doctors per capita then almost any other country (third in the world).
See above.
Under socialism the incentive is different. The incentive to come up with more efficient ways to do things is that we'd have to work less time to do the same amount of work, which means, more free time, vacation, more time for research, etc. "The amount of NECESSARY labor needed to produce the things we NEED."
Under capitalism, the ruling class does everything they can to effect the way we think. Through media, education, religion, etc. we are raised with values of a capitalist system, which is that 'dog eat dog', 'every man for himself' "bling bling" mentality. This isn't human nature, this is something we have been conditioned to think. Or in Marx's explanation - a form of false consciousness.
This kind of mentality doesn't benefit the common man...only the very rich.
This mentality would slowly go away under socialism. Since conditions determine consciousness, new generations would see the world entirely different. Think about when a baby is born. It does not know about race, violence, sexual harassment, being materialistic, greed, etc. it only learns about these things when they are passed down by society.
But in reality self-interest remains under socialism. Workers will form a class consciousness by understanding where their true self-interest lay. The bourgeoisie on the other hand have a self-interest under capitalism, in this case a class interest in controlling the class consciousness of the workers - shoring up the false consciousness of the workers that their self-interest lay with the promotion of the class system (remember the old slogan that what's good for GM is good for America--nationalism is a good tool for propping up false consciousness as is religion).
I don't know, perhaps you should look to Cuba for answers since they produce more doctors per capita then almost any other country (third in the world).
See above.
wow 206 got me interested in all this.
obviously between capitalism and communism, communism wins.
but im a believer in anarchism.
either way i have to read all about the different political philosphies and all they have to teach.
Charles A. Madison writes, "The first modern systematic exponent of anarchism was William Godwin. . . . Strongly influenced by the sentiments of the French Revolution, he argued that since man is a rational being he must not be hampered in the exercise of his pure reason
... he enunciates the proposition "God Himself has no right to be a tyrant."
wow this william godwin character has the right idea.
im bout to have another sleepless night reading all this.
Where morality is present, laws are unnecessary. Without morality, laws are unenforceable. Anonymous
Pierre-Joseph Proudhon saw anarchy as:
"a form of government or constitution in which public and private consciousness, formed through the development of science and law, is alone sufficient to maintain order and guarantee all liberties. In it, as a consequence, the institutions of the police, preventive and repressive methods, officialdom, taxation, etc., are reduced to a minimum. In it, more especially, the forms of monarchy and intensive centralization disappear, to be replaced by federal institutions and a pattern of life based on the commune."
whoever said dumb threads dont accomplish anything?
obviously between capitalism and communism, communism wins.
but im a believer in anarchism.
either way i have to read all about the different political philosphies and all they have to teach.
Charles A. Madison writes, "The first modern systematic exponent of anarchism was William Godwin. . . . Strongly influenced by the sentiments of the French Revolution, he argued that since man is a rational being he must not be hampered in the exercise of his pure reason
... he enunciates the proposition "God Himself has no right to be a tyrant."
wow this william godwin character has the right idea.
im bout to have another sleepless night reading all this.
Where morality is present, laws are unnecessary. Without morality, laws are unenforceable. Anonymous
Pierre-Joseph Proudhon saw anarchy as:
"a form of government or constitution in which public and private consciousness, formed through the development of science and law, is alone sufficient to maintain order and guarantee all liberties. In it, as a consequence, the institutions of the police, preventive and repressive methods, officialdom, taxation, etc., are reduced to a minimum. In it, more especially, the forms of monarchy and intensive centralization disappear, to be replaced by federal institutions and a pattern of life based on the commune."
whoever said dumb threads dont accomplish anything?
Why would I want to come up with more efficient ways to do my job so the other guys who are slacking will have less work to do? I believe people are apt to take advantage of this situation and put in minimum requirements while those who are motivated continue to pull the weight for all the slackers. In fact, at my job (a union shop), a major proponent of socialist philosophy constantly puts strain on his co-workers because he refuses to do any more than the minimum requirements, and frequently doesn't even meet those. This guy knows the contract (because he negotiated it) and knows exactly how little work he can get away with without getting written up. All the while, he's constantly complaining about "oppression" by management, and preaching about how people should be equally compensated.
The only way this shit floats is in theory. I think in reality, people are not going to work "for the greater goal". We are intrinsically selfish and greedy, ego feeding mother fucks. Our major motivation to put in extra work, put in hours at school learning a discipline or using our brain for something other than menial manual labor is to obtain straight cheese, not the desire to help all the welfare mother fuckers out there.
[/QUOTE]Under capitalism, the ruling class does everything they can to effect the way we think. Through media, education, religion, etc. we are raised with values of a capitalist system, which is that 'dog eat dog', 'every man for himself' "bling bling" mentality. This isn't human nature, this is something we have been conditioned to think. Or in Marx's explanation - a form of false consciousness.
This kind of mentality doesn't benefit the common man...only the very rich.[/QUOTE]
What about bill gates, dr. dre, ben and jerry, and all the other self made success stories out there? That mentality certainly benefited them, and made our society better in the process.
[/QUOTE]it only learns about these things when they are passed down by society.[/QUOTE] Or does our society endorse this mentality because it is intrinsic in human nature? What came first, the chicken or the egg?
[/QUOTE]perhaps you should look to Cuba for answers since they produce more doctors per capita then almost any other country (third in the world).
[/QUOTE] Perhaps there are so many doctors because doctors there frequently travel outside of cuba, and this is one of the only ways to get the fuck off the island?
The only way this shit floats is in theory. I think in reality, people are not going to work "for the greater goal". We are intrinsically selfish and greedy, ego feeding mother fucks. Our major motivation to put in extra work, put in hours at school learning a discipline or using our brain for something other than menial manual labor is to obtain straight cheese, not the desire to help all the welfare mother fuckers out there.
[/QUOTE]Under capitalism, the ruling class does everything they can to effect the way we think. Through media, education, religion, etc. we are raised with values of a capitalist system, which is that 'dog eat dog', 'every man for himself' "bling bling" mentality. This isn't human nature, this is something we have been conditioned to think. Or in Marx's explanation - a form of false consciousness.
This kind of mentality doesn't benefit the common man...only the very rich.[/QUOTE]
What about bill gates, dr. dre, ben and jerry, and all the other self made success stories out there? That mentality certainly benefited them, and made our society better in the process.
[/QUOTE]it only learns about these things when they are passed down by society.[/QUOTE] Or does our society endorse this mentality because it is intrinsic in human nature? What came first, the chicken or the egg?
[/QUOTE]perhaps you should look to Cuba for answers since they produce more doctors per capita then almost any other country (third in the world).
[/QUOTE] Perhaps there are so many doctors because doctors there frequently travel outside of cuba, and this is one of the only ways to get the fuck off the island?
2-0-Sixx said:
I was born in Mother Russia. In southern Siberia, the Republic of Khakassia (Респу́блика Хака́сия
to be exact.
My parents were poor working peasants. They could not afford to feed me so I was orphaned. They left me on the door step of comrade Vladimir Belotserkovsky. Shortly afterwards, they were both executed by the Capitalists because of their lack of efficiency at the factory they were employed at.
Comrade Vladimir Belotserkovsky placed me into a Communist learning school, where I was hooked up to tubes and fed communist propaganda 24/7 and placed on a strictly "communist diet." This is where i learned the truth about america and that god is a cruel joke.
Once they felt I was ready to be a super communist, I was released from the school. Shortly after the collapse of the USSR, I fled to america where I have been training ever since. My objective is to take over the US along with my ex-ussr comrades, and the Talaban of course. Cobra Commander will also join us which will be announced on a later date.
Seriously, I was born in Chicago, IL, where most of my family has lived for generations. I later moved to Seattle, where i currently live.
Definition of communist - a person who desires the liberation of the proletariat.
Because I was born here and currently live here.
Maybe you're unaware, but communism is simply an ideology. Communism has been around in America for over 100 years.
to be exact. My parents were poor working peasants. They could not afford to feed me so I was orphaned. They left me on the door step of comrade Vladimir Belotserkovsky. Shortly afterwards, they were both executed by the Capitalists because of their lack of efficiency at the factory they were employed at.
Comrade Vladimir Belotserkovsky placed me into a Communist learning school, where I was hooked up to tubes and fed communist propaganda 24/7 and placed on a strictly "communist diet." This is where i learned the truth about america and that god is a cruel joke.
Once they felt I was ready to be a super communist, I was released from the school. Shortly after the collapse of the USSR, I fled to america where I have been training ever since. My objective is to take over the US along with my ex-ussr comrades, and the Talaban of course. Cobra Commander will also join us which will be announced on a later date.
Seriously, I was born in Chicago, IL, where most of my family has lived for generations. I later moved to Seattle, where i currently live.
Definition of communist - a person who desires the liberation of the proletariat.
Because I was born here and currently live here.
Maybe you're unaware, but communism is simply an ideology. Communism has been around in America for over 100 years.
That would make a wicked movie.