Jesus Accepts Visa Now

[ilikeballs]

WASHINGTON (AFP) - The days of donating at church by dropping money into a basket may become a thing of the past if Marty Baker has his way.

Baker, a pastor in the southern state of Georgia, has come up with a divine idea to raise money for the Lord -- automated teller machines, or Giving Kiosks, that relieve worshippers of their tithe duty with the simple swipe of a credit card.

The kiosks have proved a hit at his Protestant congregation, Stevens Creek Community Church, and are beginning to pop up in other churches across the country eager to roll with the high-tech times.

"I think this technology really provides convenience to people," the 45-year-old entrepreneur told AFP. "You see, our culture lives with a debit card in their hand and so when they come into our church we need to help them and provide them with the convenience so that they can serve the Lord."

He said he came up with the idea for the teller machine several years ago when his church was trying to raise money for a new building.

"I started to examine my life and I looked at how I no longer carried cash or a checkbook but lived with a debit card in my hand," he said.

And so the first Giving Kiosk was rolled out at Stevens Creek in March 2005 and took in 100,000 dollars in donations that year. Two other machines have since been added in the church lobby.

"They've been a hit and this year we are expecting to take in close to 200,000 dollars," Baker said. "We knew from the outset that we had something here.

"It's not just about raising money ... it's about being progressive in order to connect with our culture."

Donors who use the machines get a receipt with a scripture from the Bible and can also rake in air miles or loyalty points on their credit cards.

Penny Oates, a member of Baker's congregation, said she finds the machines convenient as she seldom carries cash or checks anymore.

"I think they're wonderful," she said. "It's a great convenience, it's just very simple and easy to use."

Baker said seven churches across the country, all Protestant, have so far purchased the kiosks and dozens more are interested. The machines cost between 2,000 and 5,000 dollars, depending on the model, and require a 50-dollar monthly servicing fee.

He said churches uncomfortable with the idea of followers using their credit card in the name of God and possibly going into debt could opt for a machine that only accepts debit cards.

He also rejected criticism that he was using his position within the church to enrich himself, pointing out that the company he helped create, Automated Giving Solutions, was run by his wife.

"I do feel like the Bible encourages us to be workers," he said. "The Bible talks a lot about investment, about hard work.

"It says all hard work brings a profit and so we really feel that when you work you should be able to be profitable in your work."

 

[2-0-NINE]

DON'T GIVE INTO THEIR MONEY HUNGRY SCHEMES! THEY'LL USE THE BIBLE TO PROFIT FROM IT, THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND TRUE TITHING! THEIR FULL OF BS! THAT'S CORRUPT ORGANIZED CHRISTIANITY FOR YOU!

 

[BoMbTrEeS2]

most churches are just a business anyways

 

[WHITE DEVIL]

most churches are just a business anyways

DON'T GIVE INTO THEIR MONEY HUNGRY SCHEMES! THEY'LL USE THE BIBLE TO PROFIT FROM IT, THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND TRUE TITHING! THEIR FULL OF BS! THAT'S CORRUPT ORGANIZED CHRISTIANITY FOR YOU!

zzzzzz.....

Most churches LOSE money and constantly struggle to stay open. Most pastors work two jobs and 6-day weeks.

Members of my family are and others have been intimately involved in several churches during my lifetime both large and small. I am not a major believer in Christianity or God but I was always amazed at how thin a line most churches walk between staying open and shutting down.

Would you say this about PBS accepting credit card donations? What about the Red Cross or the Salvation Army? All these require contributions to stay open.

You mental midgets on this board swear that people are led by gunpoint and forced to donate to churches. People give money to churches because it is a service that gives back to them, and a cause they believe in. So a liquor store can accept credit, but a church cant?

Most people genuinely involved within a church receive emotional, financial, and personal assistance in many ways during times of crisis. My family (except for me) was always at one person's house or another, bringing food, praying with people, helping people work on their houses, watching their kids, etc.

There are all kinds of random shit that church leaders and members do for each other. Obviously some churches screw some people, some people get done dirty by the church or members of the church, but that goes with any major institution.

People on this board often rely on thin, uninformed blanket statements that prove nothing. Talking down on churches and organized religion because that's what you've seen Heresy or some other smart person do, or pretending youre some kind of fake revolutionary by opposing every possible major institution you can right before shopping at Walmart, buying McDonalds, and tuning in to your nightly viewing of "Survivor" and "American Idol" does not prove shit.

 

[HERESY]

zzzzzz.....

Most churches LOSE money and constantly struggle to stay open. Most pastors work two jobs and 6-day weeks.

Members of my family are and others have been intimately involved in several churches during my lifetime both large and small. I am not a major believer in Christianity or God but I was always amazed at how thin a line most churches walk between staying open and shutting down.

Would you say this about PBS accepting credit card donations? What about the Red Cross or the Salvation Army? All these require contributions to stay open.

You mental midgets on this board swear that people are led by gunpoint and forced to donate to churches. People give money to churches because it is a service that gives back to them, and a cause they believe in. So a liquor store can accept credit, but a church cant?

Most people genuinely involved within a church receive emotional, financial, and personal assistance in many ways during times of crisis. My family (except for me) was always at one person's house or another, bringing food, praying with people, helping people work on their houses, watching their kids, etc.

There are all kinds of random shit that church leaders and members do for each other. Obviously some churches screw some people, some people get done dirty by the church or members of the church, but that goes with any major institution.

People on this board often rely on thin, uninformed blanket statements that prove nothing. Talking down on churches and organized religion because that's what you've seen Heresy or some other smart person do, or pretending youre some kind of fake revolutionary by opposing every possible major institution you can right before shopping at Walmart, buying McDonalds, and tuning in to your nightly viewing of "Survivor" and "American Idol" does not prove shit.

Keep my name off your fingers you quadriplegic.

 

[kayvee]

zzzzzz.....

Most churches LOSE money and constantly struggle to stay open. Most pastors work two jobs and 6-day weeks.

Members of my family are and others have been intimately involved in several churches during my lifetime both large and small. I am not a major believer in Christianity or God but I was always amazed at how thin a line most churches walk between staying open and shutting down.

Would you say this about PBS accepting credit card donations? What about the Red Cross or the Salvation Army? All these require contributions to stay open.

You mental midgets on this board swear that people are led by gunpoint and forced to donate to churches. People give money to churches because it is a service that gives back to them, and a cause they believe in. So a liquor store can accept credit, but a church cant?

Most people genuinely involved within a church receive emotional, financial, and personal assistance in many ways during times of crisis. My family (except for me) was always at one person's house or another, bringing food, praying with people, helping people work on their houses, watching their kids, etc.

There are all kinds of random shit that church leaders and members do for each other. Obviously some churches screw some people, some people get done dirty by the church or members of the church, but that goes with any major institution.

People on this board often rely on thin, uninformed blanket statements that prove nothing. Talking down on churches and organized religion because that's what you've seen Heresy or some other smart person do, or pretending youre some kind of fake revolutionary by opposing every possible major institution you can right before shopping at Walmart, buying McDonalds, and tuning in to your nightly viewing of "Survivor" and "American Idol" does not prove shit.

owned.

~k.

 

[Rasan]

do they take debit?

 

[kayvee]

do they take debit?

u would think so.

~k.

 

[Rasan]

i told my girl and she thinks its garbage that a church would allow you to use a credit card and have a kiosk. she old school..
as for me, can you say frequent flyer miles! lol

 

[Speedy]

Do they take food Stamps?

 

[2-0-Sixx]

To they take shit smeared in envelopes WHITE DEVIL?

 

[HERESY]

Most churches LOSE money and constantly struggle to stay open.

Blame the pastor and whoever is in charge of the financial planning.

http://www.christianitytoday.com/yc/2000/006/6.34.html

Most pastors work two jobs and 6-day weeks.

Source please.

Members of my family are and others have been intimately involved in several churches during my lifetime both large and small. I am not a major believer in Christianity or God but I was always amazed at how thin a line most churches walk between staying open and shutting down.

Save your crocodile tears for someone who actually cares. You are not amazed by how many walk a thin line between staying open and shutting down. You are amazed at that, yet you aren't amazed at their ability to have a so-called faith in God even when times are bad? Sure...

Would you say this about PBS accepting credit card donations? What about the Red Cross or the Salvation Army? All these require contributions to stay open.

There is a difference between a contribution and a misguided and warped doctrine that forces members to give 10% of their earnings. If you are going to give you should give freely, and the church should have faith in GOD to provide. You believe in miracles? You believe God is something real? Well, expect a real check under your porch when all else fails or shut it down and do it moving. Niggas can preach all day long about "thus saith the lord", but when it comes time to REALLY call on God and depend on them they are lookin for niggas with visas and discover.

You mental midgets on this board swear that people are led by gunpoint and forced to donate to churches

This is coming from the man who cried and begged for God while he was dying of cancer, but has since DENOUNCED him now that he is in remission. Forced to donate? YES! I know of SEVERAL churchs in the bay that actually take the 10% cut from the members PAY CHECK. Also, with the prosperity doctrine and the misues of scripture, people ARE forced to donate.

People give money to churches because it is a service that gives back to them, and a cause they believe in.

What has church given back to the average member? Nothing. Again, many people give to churches because they are PRESSURED into giving to them. Listen to the doctrine these people bring. The ones that preach the prosperity doctrine rely on twisting scriptures to make people feel bad so they can donate. These people are playing on emotions, and it has nothing to do with giving back to a service that you have benefited from.

So a liquor store can accept credit, but a church cant?

If people donate with a credit card oh well, but do you remember what Yeshi did to the people in the temple? HE BEAT THEM OUT OF IT. John 2:15-16

Most people genuinely involved within a church receive emotional, financial, and personal assistance in many ways during times of crisis.

Most people that are in good with the pastor and deacons. Yes, you are correct. The average nigga coming off the streets and gutter needing help with his light bill? No. The average joe who got burned out of his home? No.

My family (except for me) was always at one person's house or another, bringing food, praying with people, helping people work on their houses, watching their kids, etc.

You were too busy mocking God instead of doing what your family was doing, but your family is no different from mine. I come from a "church" family. My father is still a deacon, three of my uncles were pastors, my grandfather was a pastor (so were 2 of his brothers), my great grandfather was a pastor (so was one of his brothers), and I can't count on two hands how many of my cousins have churches in Oakland, Berkeley, L.A., Little Rock, and Pine Bluff. Do all churches do what our families were called to do? NO! And, I tell you what, why don't YOU start getting in the trenches with me and coming with me to B-town once a month.

There are all kinds of random shit that church leaders and members do for each other. Obviously some churches screw some people, some people get done dirty by the church or members of the church, but that goes with any major institution

Praise da Lard shaints! Jesziss be comin ta help us n ya should be forgibben us fo what weez be doin!

People on this board often rely on thin, uninformed blanket statements that prove nothing.

If you are putting me in that group put your money where your mouth is and lets get the ball rolling. Otherwise refrain.

Talking down on churches and organized religion because that's what you've seen Heresy or some other smart person do

I've backed up every reason for every word I've said about the church. Why is it that you list me, but you don't list the MANY other people who speak openly against the church (especially ex church members and athiests.)

or pretending youre some kind of fake revolutionary by opposing every possible major institution you can right before shopping at Walmart, buying McDonalds, and tuning in to your nightly viewing of "Survivor" and "American Idol" does not prove shit.

You just told on yourself.

 

[HERESY]

And while you are at it, dig up that 501 c3 thread, so I can post the response I forgot to add. MAKE YOURSELF USEFUL.

 

[HERESY]

Do they take food Stamps?

Probably not. Some of them won't even take donated food. I tried to donate hella food (all purchased from the store the same week I tried to donate), and I was told it was better to give money because they knew what the people needed.

 

[HERESY]

To they take shit smeared in envelopes WHITE DEVIL?

You would really send that?

 

[Rasan]

but by adding a kiosk and credit cards etc, shows the church as a place of business. the church is not for that..its a place of worship and to hear the word, not to have serveral payment options

 

[HERESY]

but by adding a kiosk and credit cards etc, shows the church as a place of business. the church is not for that..its a place of worship and to hear the word, not to have serveral payment options

Case closed.

 

[WHITE DEVIL]

Blame the pastor and whoever is in charge of the financial planning.

http://www.christianitytoday.com/yc/2000/006/6.34.html

In the link you posted it states that churches are suffering from their lowest levels of giving since 1955. Does this not support my statement that churches struggle?

Also, you posted a link about how churches can / need to improve their financial stewardship as if that is ironclad evidence that financial struggles within churches are simply a matter of better money management.

I know even you don't believe the matter is that simple.

Save your crocodile tears for someone who actually cares.

Whatever you want to call it. What I was attempting to illustrate is that the operations of most churches I have seen and experienced have been much more a labor of love and conviction than some sort of profit scheme, and this applied to what used to be the Vineyard on Harrison in SF (2000+ people) as well as more than a few small churches on the peninsula.

There is a difference between a contribution and a misguided and warped doctrine that forces members to give 10% of their earnings. If you are going to give you should give freely, and the church should have faith in GOD to provide.

So what you're saying is that people in the majority of churches don't give freely, and in fact they are either coerced, hustled, or in some way pressured to give. This was never the case in my experience.

It's not like folks was tillin up the tithing basket as it got to the end of the row, or people were necessarily marking or labeling their donations. If you had a different experience there was obviously a problem with the churches you were attending.

Niggas can preach all day long about "thus saith the lord", but when it comes time to REALLY call on God and depend on them they are lookin for niggas with visas and discover.

1. Dude in link said he was just tryin to make it easier or provide a way for different way for folks to donate.

2. Have you ever been in a church were someone showed up to the church and said "ey, I'm tryna help out with something, what can I do?" And the pastor said some shit like "get the fuck on grimey ass nigga". If so, once again there was a problem with the church you were attending.

Forced to donate? YES! I know of SEVERAL churchs in the bay that actually take the 10% cut from the members PAY CHECK.
Also, with the prosperity doctrine and the misues of scripture, people ARE forced to donate.

LDS takes your tax returns. If there are Christian churches doing it as well, they are similarly misguided.

And as far as people being forced to donate, they need to 1. take that up with their elders, or 2. leave the church. Prosperity is often hocked by mass media televangelists, but how much information can Americans really trust from standard media anyways?

What has church given back to the average member? Nothing.

Sources please.

Again, many people give to churches because they are PRESSURED into giving to them. Listen to the doctrine these people bring. The ones that preach the prosperity doctrine rely on twisting scriptures to make people feel bad so they can donate. These people are playing on emotions, and it has nothing to do with giving back to a service that you have benefited from.

Again, this is why it is up to people to question and evaluate who and what they are associated with.

If people donate with a credit card oh well, but do you remember what Yeshi did to the people in the temple? HE BEAT THEM OUT OF IT. John 2:15-16

Wasn't that an issue of moneylending/changing, the charging of interest, and commerce in the temple?

The temple back then got its money from the state, so there was no need to donate. How does that apply in this day and age? Does it mean that no money whatsoever is permissible in church? Must churches be some outdoor tent meeting shit because nonprofit donations are necessarily the same thing as commerce and profit making?

The average nigga coming off the streets and gutter needing help with his light bill? No. The average joe who got burned out of his home? No.

I have seen people helped in both these situations by legitimate churches.

If you are putting me in that group put your money where your mouth is and lets get the ball rolling. Otherwise refrain.

You interpreted this, and other parts of my post as a direct attack on you, when in fact it was addressed to weak people whose opinions change every week, sometimes every thread.

I've backed up every reason for every word I've said about the church. Why is it that you list me, but you don't list the MANY other people who speak openly against the church (especially ex church members and athiests.)

Once again, I was not attacking you for your opinion. See above in reference to know nothings who are quick to hop on bandwagons.

And not all of the atheists and ex church members are simpletons.

 

[HERESY]

In the link you posted it states that churches are suffering from their lowest levels of giving since 1955. Does this not support my statement that churches struggle?Also, you posted a link about how churches can / need to improve their financial stewardship as if that is ironclad evidence that financial struggles within churches are simply a matter of better money management.

I know even you don't believe the matter is that simple

No one denied churches suffering from a low financial level. However, there is a reason for it and you can start with what the article started with which is MISMANAGEMENT and the PASTOR.

Whatever you want to call it. What I was attempting to illustrate is that the operations of most churches I have seen and experienced have been much more a labor of love and conviction than some sort of profit scheme, and this applied to what used to be the Vineyard on Harrison in SF (2000+ people) as well as more than a few small churches on the peninsula.

It is ironic that you can see these institutions of labor and love, yet you can reject them. Too strange for me.

So what you're saying is that people in the majority of churches don't give freely, and in fact they are either coerced, hustled, or in some way pressured to give. This was never the case in my experience.

What is your schedule looking like in november? Lets go and sit down in 8 churches (two a day every sunday) and lets see what we can dig up. I am saying the majority of people in churches are coerced, hustled, brainwashed and forced to give money. Let me ask you this. When does collection usually happen? Right when church starts, after praise and worship, or after the preacher has finished? Think about it before you answer.

It's not like folks was tillin up the tithing basket as it got to the end of the row, or people were necessarily marking or labeling their donations. If you had a different experience there was obviously a problem with the churches you were attending.

WD, I make it a POINT to walk in churches, sit down and peep what is going on. That way, when I start my mission, they will have NO EXCUSE when they are condemned. Yes, I have been to churches were people mark and label their donations, and even some had BRACKETS. If you donated this much you were in this group, this much that group, that much that group etc. I also saw a pastor take TWO collections. One was for the church (they were trying to hit a 200k mark), but the other was for himself and he called this "THE TRINITY OFFERING". He said for the trinity offering you have to give three times the amount you would normally give or did give and he said this was for him because he was the head.

1. Dude in link said he was just tryin to make it easier or provide a way for different way for folks to donate.

Again, thats not what I have a problem with.

2. Have you ever been in a church were someone showed up to the church and said "ey, I'm tryna help out with something, what can I do?" And the pastor said some shit like "get the fuck on grimey ass nigga". If so, once again there was a problem with the church you were attending.

I'll do better than that. I myself was rejected for BAPTISM at not one, not two, not three, but FOUR churches. REJECTED FOR BAPTISM. Why? Because I wanted to be baptized but not hold membership, and because I did not agree with going through some classes that "determined" my knowledge and level of faith. As far as turning away when people help yes. Again, one pastor told me it was better to give money because they knew what the people wanted...

LDS takes your tax returns. If there are Christian churches doing it as well, they are similarly misguided.

And as far as people being forced to donate, they need to 1. take that up with their elders, or 2. leave the church. Prosperity is often hocked by mass media televangelists, but how much information can Americans really trust from standard media anyways?

2 is the best option. 1 will get you ostrascized and kicked out, so you might as well leave on your own. Also, many smaller churches are doing the same thing the larger ones are doing (prosperity doctrine.) It's the same thing but on a smaller scale because they don't have as many members as the larger ones, but as soon as they grow they step their game up.

Sources please.

Look outsider your window, or walk to where the bums are. Thats all the proof you need.

Again, this is why it is up to people to question and evaluate who and what they are associated with.

How can they? Who are we talkign about here? Americans? Listen, we are not talking about people who think for themselves. We are talking about many people (NOT ALL) who are led by the hand and believe in God because Pastor Peter said so.

Wasn't that an issue of moneylending/changing, the charging of interest, and commerce in the temple?

And these things go on the churches today. Trinity offerings, church pyramid schemes (yes this happens often) and selling those DAMN BOOKS AND TAPES!

The temple back then got its money from the state, so there was no need to donate. How does that apply in this day and age? Does it mean that no money whatsoever is permissible in church? Must churches be some outdoor tent meeting shit because nonprofit donations are necessarily the same thing as commerce and profit making?

There was no need to donate? Why was the widow who gave LESS than a penny more blessed than all of those who gave in abundance? Those people were donating out the ass, and the same thing that was happening then is going on now -- only they replaced the doves and lambs with dvd's and audio cd's telling you how to reach heaven. :dead:

What I am saying is if you claim to depend on God nigga depend on God. Don't depend on 501 c3 money, don't even depend on your congregation. Step your ass out on faith and ask God to send your ass some manna or something. Lead by example and follow what Yeshia said. And if I actually saw a church out doors and thats what they did every week I would have SO MUCH respect for that church because they are most likely out in the trenches and getting with the people and not in the big churches with the higher rooms, lavish seats, big ass tv screens and hundreds of gay jesus pics on the wall.

I have seen people helped in both these situations by legitimate churches.

Thats rare....

You interpreted this, and other parts of my post as a direct attack on you, when in fact it was addressed to weak people whose opinions change every week, sometimes every thread.

O.k I'll give you that one. My apologies. asses this nigga a shot of cognac:

Once again, I was not attacking you for your opinion. See above in reference to know nothings who are quick to hop on bandwagons.

And not all of the atheists and ex church members are simpletons.

:gives him another shot:

 

[2-0-NINE]

@WHITE DEVIL JOHN 2:13-16! If you really are faithful to Christ then you don't need riches to organize your ministry. I get into many arguments with Christians about Mega TV pastors like Joel Osteen and Benny Hinn, they say they're blessed because they are doing the True work of God. I shake my head of course and argue, and as a typical Indoctrinated Christian they'll tell me Satan is messing with my mind. I just laugh. They say their millionaires because they're really spreading the word of God, nope, their millionaires because they promote selling of their books, and their false hope speeches about Healing.

Ok, if they're so blessed, why did my grandfather RIP do his ministry with out cost to join him? He went around the world preaching, with just his hymns, his bible and his few ministry men. Was he not blessed? Did he not feel that since he wasn't rich he wasn't blessed like a Benny Hinn? No because he was doing the Work which Jesus left him to do.